109 replies to this topic

[FSTP]

I started this thread with the intent of simply better informing potential buyers of boosted queens what the true risks are in doing so. That way they would have a more balanced understanding of what is really going on rather than just the marketing fluff they'd otherwise read from the people selling them the ants. The reason I didn't initially outright name THA was I didn't feel the need to. They maybe one of the first to be selling these boosted queens in such a way but I felt that they would eventually likely not be the only one doing this and to make a more generalized post would be more helpful then openly singling out one sole vender. 

 

Nowhere in any of my posts do I outright tell anyone to never buy any of these queens from THA. All I did was let people know that you're taking on a near equal risk to that of a newly captured queen in terms of outcome success. As there is no way to truly ascertain a queens fertility status until you've witnessed her produce her very own nanitic workers. Also I don't believe I've disparaged anyone in my posts. I only make it clear my opinion which still stands. That charging an equal price for a boosted queen and a fully established legitimate colony is rather absurd as they are no where near equal in value. 

 

 

@soulsynapse I have no idea what you mean by "FSTP you of all people being ungrateful of THA is laughable".  I own several THA products and use them happily, I also still plan on buying more of their products in the very near future. No where am I ungrateful. I have a lot of respect for THA's formicarium designs and that side of their business. I can see the bigger picture and that is why I find this practice of selling boosted queens a troublesome concept. So lets get at least some things clear. I did not create this thread to "bash" THA had that been my goal I would have out right named THA in my original thread starter. No where am I trying to "pull other people down to raise myself up" anyone that knows me IRL and/or in this community knows that's simply not something I'd do, I'm more likely to throw myself under a bus before ever doing that to anyone else. These forums are here to give conversations like these a chance. To give a place to discuss what happening in the anting world. That doesn't just mean discussing all the cool stuff. It also means providing a place to point out things some might find to be wrong or questionable at best, and not just sweep it under the rug as "someone is trying to bash". However, if like you said "the reality is this thread doesn't even matter" why was it even necessary for you to respond? Then you ending with "I think you're all better than this and this thread is an embarrassment. Do better." Now that is cute, down right adorable.

 

 

So if at any point in the future a new ant keeper contacts me asking about ants (this happens about 3-4 times a week through youtube) or these "advanced colonies" specifically I'm going to succinctly explain why they're not a desirable option, but I'm not going to downright tell them not to buy them.

Edited by FSTP, August 21 2019 - 3:20 AM.

[drtrmiller]

By law every end customer has a 2 year warranty that the item (in German law animals are treated as items in sale of goods law) is free of faults. Normally if the customer notices any fault like queen doesn't lay eggs, or the queen dies etc. he would have to proof that this defect was caused by something that was already there when the customer received the ants. So it is quite hard to proof that.

 

However within the first 6 months after buying not the customer has to proof that it was my fault but I have to proof that it was the customers fault. So basically if the queen dies within the first 6 months I can't do much if it wasn't obviously hit by something or you see other signs of mistreatment. I would have to replace the queen or pay the money back if I don't have a replacement.

 

And even with that quite hard law for businesses people still can make money selling ants.

 

Therefore I think THA should give some kind of warranty maybe 1 or 2 month that if the queen dies during that period or doesn't lay any new eggs or brood doesn't develop to workers he will send a replacement or give the money back.

 

If I was selling ants on Amazon, 30 days would be the standard time frame during which a buyer would be allowed to open a return request.  I agree with Barristan that 30-60 days is an acceptable starting point for a warranty standard, given how small and fragile ants generally are.  I would factor the frequency and cost of these returns/refunds into my pricing, even if it means adjusting my prices upwards or downwards, over time.  My goal would be total customer obsession and transparency, and that means assuming more risk, as is to be expected with the sale of livestock.

 

It has been explained elsewhere that one particular vendor chose an "industry standard" arrive-alive guarantee, and that seems good enough for them.  But why settle for the "industry standard" used with other, completely different organisms with different physiologies and care requirements, when you can create a brand new standard for this brand new thing that is shipping ant queens in the United States?

 

I have heard a lot of "Company X really cares about their customers; I trust they will do the right thing!"  And yet, the company had the opportunity to be first to market and demonstrate that level of commitment they have to their customers, but instead chose to launch with a deceptive pricing structure and upsell scheme that requires three different customer inputs (see below), a product description so dishonest, it has already changed several times, and the least possible assumption of risk for delivery of a living organism, with no further warranty of the product after delivery.

 

Edited by drtrmiller, August 21 2019 - 4:08 AM.

[Kaelwizard]

Is there any way to find out the chances of my colony surviving? Some of this really worries me and I want to know if I made the right choice. I bought this colony because all of the native ants that I caught had died or been put out of their misery. I don’t know if you realize how much having a successful colony means to me. My friend has a C. novae colony with two workers and I can’t even look at it without feeling extreme jealousy.

[drtrmiller]

Is there any way to find out the chances of my colony surviving? Some of this really worries me and I want to know if I made the right choice. I bought this colony because all of the native ants that I caught had died or been put out of their misery. I don’t know if you realize how much having a successful colony means to me. My friend has a C. novae colony with two workers and I can’t even look at it without feeling extreme jealousy.

 

The probability that the queen will produce a healthy colony depends somewhat on the genetic fitness of the individual, but probably much more heavily on the conduct of the user caring for the ants.

 

If all your ants died before, that may because of something you did wrong, in which case buying an expensive queen from a third-party supplier may not help very much.

[Kaelwizard]

Actually test tube floods were a cause most of the deaths and also one died while I was on vacation. Lots of the queens I have kept were injured individuals. I have a mini hearth for the colony to move into also. I am pretty confident for this colony, but I am going to be way more careful. I also have done a lot of research on the and read some of Drew’s journals on Pogonomyrmex. I have a lot of seeds to spare, including black nyjer seed, which I’ve heard is a favorite. I also have a heat mat. If the colony gets big enough, I have a 20 gallon tank that I might be able to use if my parents let me. These are a dream species for me and I am hoping they will become a successful colony.

[Mercutia]

Actually test tube floods were a cause most of the deaths and also one died while I was on vacation. Lots of the queens I have kept were injured individuals. I have a mini hearth for the colony to move into also. I am pretty confident for this colony, but I am going to be way more careful. I also have done a lot of research on the and read some of Drew’s journals on Pogonomyrmex. I have a lot of seeds to spare, including black nyjer seed, which I’ve heard is a favorite. I also have a heat mat. If the colony gets big enough, I have a 20 gallon tank that I might be able to use if my parents let me. These are a dream species for me and I am hoping they will become a successful colony.

On the plus side, a hearth setup will do better for not drowning your ants although personally it's been a very rare occasion for myself that ants drown in my test tube setups but I don't use heating cables and such. Just don't try to do too much all at once. I find beginner ant keepers are like beginner plant keepers. They want to do too much all at once and end up killing colonies with their love and attention. Patience is a virtue in this hobby. Just lay back and let nature do her thing. Hopefully your queen is viable and you'll secure a nice little colony.

[Serafine]

If ants drown in a test tube there can basically only be 4 reasons for that:

- The water tank cotton plug wasn't stuffed in properly so water leaked through it

- The test tubes were placed in a cold environment and heated by a heating cable (or somehow ended up in direct sunlight) which lead to massive amounts of condensation in the tube and subsequently flooding

- The water tank was almost dry already and at some point the wet cotton collapsed due to the lack of negative pressure so air could flow freely into the water tank and as a consequence the water just flows through the cotton

- The ants dug through the cotton which caused the water tank to leak

Aside from the last one (which seems to happen very rarely) those are entirely preventable (#3 can be prevented by mounting the tube in a slight upwards angle so the water stays at the lower end of the tube).

 

About guarantees -  I don't know on which planet you live but I have NEVER seen an ant shop that guaranteed survival beyond arrival. There are shops that will send you a replacement but by far not all of them.

There's so many things a buyer can do to screw over a colony that it's pretty much impossible to guarantee survival for two or three months, just look at the reddit and facebook groups where kids just dump their Lasius ants into a bone dry uncle miton farm or one of these awful gel farms (and OF COURSE they will tell you that they did nothing wrong and it's just the seller's fault). At least THA does only sell ants with a proper nest - that is WAY more than most ant shops do to secure the survival of their sold ants.

 

In my opinion ant queens that did not successfully raise their first workers should not be sold at all by any ant shop (but of course they all do it, every single one of them) - even GAN has that rule despite not bothering to actually enforce it (and their other rules) most of the time.

[Barristan]

About guarantees -  I don't know on which planet you live but I have NEVER seen an ant shop that guaranteed survival beyond arrival. There are shops that will send you a replacement but by far not all of them.

There's so many things a buyer can do to screw over a colony that it's pretty much impossible to guarantee survival for two or three months, just look at the reddit and facebook groups where kids just dump their Lasius ants into a bone dry uncle miton farm or one of these awful gel farms (and OF COURSE they will tell you that they did nothing wrong and it's just the seller's fault). At least THA does only sell ants with a proper nest - that is WAY more than most ant shops do to secure the survival of their sold ants.

 

In Germany they have to and you probably know that "Gewährleistung" which is also applied to animals (there have already be cases with other types of animals, mainly cattle or dogs and some horses. And during first 6 month the shop has to proof that it was the customer's fault.

But I know that a lot of shops will try to weasel them out of this and telling the customer that it was his fault. I'm sure you know a specific German shop that is an expert in that...

 

It is nothing else than buying a computer if it won't turn on within the first 6 months you get a replacement and big companies like amazon won't even question if it was your fault or not because the law is on customers side and it is hard to proof that the customer did something wrong.

 

But of course I would let me sent pictures of the dead queen and if I have doubts I can even ask that the customers sends me the dead queen back. But unless the queen was crushed by a heavy item I will have a hard time to proof that customer's mistreatment caused the death...

Edited by Barristan, August 21 2019 - 7:54 AM.

[Canadian anter]

Okay I have a lot to say about this


[On returns of ants]
I personally believe that this isn't nearly the most relevant thing here, but I'll first address it by saying that I personally think that this return should last a week at most, especially for a mostly semi-claustral ant such as Pogonomyrmex. In live organisms, it is frequently the case that the care of the customer is more important to the organism's survival than the initial conditions in which it was sold. I do not think their is an issue with any decision to have a customer guarantee for [less than x days.]

[On pricing]
Though because I don't know about the conditions of how vendors of Pogonomyrmex sell their ants (profit margins, quantities available) I cannot really comment on the pricing specifically, but I do agree that from the perspective of the average antkeeper, the prices offered are extremely high. Granted, I have also seen pricing that has been just as high or even higher in the United States regardless of whether they were Pogonomyrmex occidentalis or not. I will also say explicitly that I don't condone the upselling of these boosted Pogonomyrmex occidentalis colonies for an additional 50% of the price due to the still unproven nature of these queens and the lower survival rates of Pogonomyrmex specifically. I also believe that it is detrimental to the antkeeping community to take advantage of a the fresh hype by offering such lucrative prices. I however, don't believe any of this is terrible as long as the customer is well-informed, as explained in the last section.

[On selling fresh queens]
I do not think that there is anything wrong with selling fresh queens. I do believe that it is a vendor's responsibility to ensure that there is a high chance that these queens are proven (ex. Collecting farther away from nests, not collecting queens not yet flown) but I do think that unproven queens should be sold at an accordingly lower price than proven queens

[On customer information]
I believe that this is really the only important issue here, and that is the responsibility of vendors to inform their consumers. I will vouch for the fact that brood boosting seems to raise chances of survival dramatically but I definitely think that providing a figure such as "nearly 100%" is irresponsible, especially when citing a study on a species of ant that is vastly different from the one being sold. I also disagree with calling them "advanced colonies" and personally believe it objectionable not to explicitly explain the brood boosting, and especially the "unproven-ness" of these queens and that no queen sold here is guaranteed to be fertile.

Edited by Canadian anter, August 21 2019 - 8:21 AM.

[Kaelwizard]

If ants drown in a test tube there can basically only be 4 reasons for that:
- The water tank cotton plug wasn't stuffed in properly so water leaked through it
- The test tubes were placed in a cold environment and heated by a heating cable (or somehow ended up in direct sunlight) which lead to massive amounts of condensation in the tube and subsequently flooding
- The water tank was almost dry already and at some point the wet cotton collapsed due to the lack of negative pressure so air could flow freely into the water tank and as a consequence the water just flows through the cotton
- The ants dug through the cotton which caused the water tank to leak
Aside from the last one (which seems to happen very rarely) those are entirely preventable (#3 can be prevented by mounting the tube in a slight upwards angle so the water stays at the lower end of the tube).

About guarantees - I don't know on which planet you live but I have NEVER seen an ant shop that guaranteed survival beyond arrival. There are shops that will send you a replacement but by far not all of them.
There's so many things a buyer can do to screw over a colony that it's pretty much impossible to guarantee survival for two or three months, just look at the reddit and facebook groups where kids just dump their Lasius ants into a bone dry uncle miton farm or one of these awful gel farms (and OF COURSE they will tell you that they did nothing wrong and it's just the seller's fault). At least THA does only sell ants with a proper nest - that is WAY more than most ant shops do to secure the survival of their sold ants.

In my opinion ant queens that did not successfully raise their first workers should not be sold at all by any ant shop (but of course they all do it, every single one of them) - even GAN has that rule despite not bothering to actually enforce it (and their other rules) most of the time.

I never said he guaranteed it. He actually said he doesn’t know if they will survive shipping. He just said that the ones that they have raised so far have had an almost 100% success rate, which may or may not be true.

[MegaMyrmex]

 

If ants drown in a test tube there can basically only be 4 reasons for that:
- The water tank cotton plug wasn't stuffed in properly so water leaked through it
- The test tubes were placed in a cold environment and heated by a heating cable (or somehow ended up in direct sunlight) which lead to massive amounts of condensation in the tube and subsequently flooding
- The water tank was almost dry already and at some point the wet cotton collapsed due to the lack of negative pressure so air could flow freely into the water tank and as a consequence the water just flows through the cotton
- The ants dug through the cotton which caused the water tank to leak
Aside from the last one (which seems to happen very rarely) those are entirely preventable (#3 can be prevented by mounting the tube in a slight upwards angle so the water stays at the lower end of the tube).

About guarantees - I don't know on which planet you live but I have NEVER seen an ant shop that guaranteed survival beyond arrival. There are shops that will send you a replacement but by far not all of them.
There's so many things a buyer can do to screw over a colony that it's pretty much impossible to guarantee survival for two or three months, just look at the reddit and facebook groups where kids just dump their Lasius ants into a bone dry uncle miton farm or one of these awful gel farms (and OF COURSE they will tell you that they did nothing wrong and it's just the seller's fault). At least THA does only sell ants with a proper nest - that is WAY more than most ant shops do to secure the survival of their sold ants.

In my opinion ant queens that did not successfully raise their first workers should not be sold at all by any ant shop (but of course they all do it, every single one of them) - even GAN has that rule despite not bothering to actually enforce it (and their other rules) most of the time.

I never said he guaranteed it. He actually said he doesn’t know if they will survive shipping. He just said that the ones that they have raised so far have had an almost 100% success rate, which may or may not be true.

 

Properly shipping invertebrates is really an entirely different subject but if done properly, the ants should arrive safe and sound. I know tons of people who have shipped various insects, anywhere from tarantulas to praying mantids, and all have arrived safely, even in the harshest of conditons. On the topic of the success rate on raising the queens, there's really no definitive answer but I can say that with the brood-boosted pupae, there's a chance that it could work but for the queen to establish a healthy colony, it will mostly depend on the fact if she's fertile or not. If she's laying eggs that may be a good sign but then again queens that laid infertile eggs continued to care for them even though they emerged to male alates. Brood boosting will greatly increase a queen(especially a semi-claustral queen)'s chance of survival but if she is infertile, then she won't be able to found a colony successfully. It would be much better and more reassuring if THA would sell queen ants that have at least 1 nanitic so that there's a much greater chance that the queen would be able to found the colony. 

 

Also as for the price on the other website...holy moly, that's a bit way too much for a couple of ants.

[dspdrew]

When I sell ant colonies, I usually tell the buyer that I'll try to replace the colony if the queen drops dead within the first 2 months or so. I may or may not have another colony of that species, but I might have others, or they might have to wait until the next season. I think in the majority of cases the queen will just die suddenly; it happens quite often unfortunately. If the buyer says I woke up the next day and the entire colony was dead, I would probably not replace them, because it would be obvious they screwed up. Luckily I have only had to replace colonies a few times, out of hundreds of colonies sold. The vast majority of the deaths I hear about happened after a year or more, or were admittedly their mistakes. Here in CA, many of them are Argentine ant attacks. I always tell them to make sure that ants not only can't get out of the setup, but can't get in either.

 

When it comes to selling brand new queens, I generally only sell to people I know, or people who know what they are doing, and know exactly what they are getting (like drtmiller said, a lottery ticket). This is why I generally sell new queens for anywhere from 5 to 20 dollars, depending on multiple factors. Most people buy them in larger amounts as well. Needless to say, I don't replace brand new queens.

[Rin]

Is there any way to find out the chances of my colony surviving? Some of this really worries me and I want to know if I made the right choice. I bought this colony because all of the native ants that I caught had died or been put out of their misery. I don’t know if you realize how much having a successful colony means to me. My friend has a C. novae colony with two workers and I can’t even look at it without feeling extreme jealousy.

I suspect the floods are a result of the cotton not being tight enough or the heat causes condensation and small queens could drown. If you can find Crematogaster queens they grow fast. Camponotus are very slow growers. I'd post a picture of my setup but I'm not sure I'm using this forum correctly yet.

Edited by Rin, August 21 2019 - 1:51 PM.

[Kaelwizard]

Is there any way to find out the chances of my colony surviving? Some of this really worries me and I want to know if I made the right choice. I bought this colony because all of the native ants that I caught had died or been put out of their misery. I don’t know if you realize how much having a successful colony means to me. My friend has a C. novae colony with two workers and I can’t even look at it without feeling extreme jealousy.

I suspect the floods are a result of the cotton not being tight enough or the heat causes condensation and small queens could drown. If you can find Crematogaster queens they grow fast. Camponotus are very slow growers. I'd post a picture of my setup but I'm not sure I'm using this forum correctly yet.

I have a P. occidentalis colony coming already. I can’t keep Crematogaster because they can escape too easily.

[FSTP]

Make a journal KaelWizard about your Pogonomyrmex when receive them. Could be helpful for future buyers keepers.

[Kaelwizard]

Make a journal KaelWizard about your Pogonomyrmex when receive them. Could be helpful for future buyers keepers.

They will be included in my ant journal.

[Xanuri]

The Vendor in question has updated their description on their website, in addition this email message was sent out to all customers who have placed orders!

 

This email is for everyone who has ordered Pogonomyrmex occidentalis from us in the past week.  I want to update everyone on approximately when and how the orders will ship, the state of the ants currently (as they are fast growing and change daily), as well as to clear up any misunderstandings that may have come up in regard to what you’ll be receiving and how they’ve been cared for prior to sending them out.

 

Shipping and Time Delays

Shipping will begin once we have all the materials needed.  (NOTE: You are welcome to pick these ants up immediately, if you are within driving distance).  This is because after speaking with the post office we received instructions that it was not quite as simple as putting a label on the box with live insects.  Procedure requires labeling, containment, and protection.  As this process of shipping out of state without need of a permit is new to everyone, myself included, we’re glad that as far as unforeseen setbacks go, this one was relatively minor.  As a result, we have opted to ship them inside rigid PVC pipe, secure on both ends.  We are currently looking into the viability of cold packs and depending on the results of the subsequent testing, we may include them in the packaging to ensure your colonies arrive safe and healthy.  The big thing we are waiting on is the labeling for the outside of the boxes themselves.  I anticipate sometime in the middle of next week to receive these items and begin shipping with first orders.

 

It will be important for the health of the ants during transit for you and I to communicate regarding shipping conditions and logistics.  I will not ship out ants on dates where the destination temperatures are not considered safe for live arrival UNLESS I have spoken with you and you are ready for them to arrive during the day (i.e. you will be home waiting for them, or someone else will).  You can (and should!) use the tracking service on www.usps.com with your tracking number you receive with your shipping confirmation email.  You can also sign up for text updated on their website as well, so you will be notified when they are dropped off.

 

Current state of the colonies, at time of writing:

Approximately 50% of queens now have several larvae with tiny eggs.  My feeling is by the time the first ones ship out we should be close to seeing pupae, just a few short days from now. They look great and I am posting videos daily on our Facebook group “Tar Heel Ants Interactive Newsletter” showing off these amazing ants!  I invite all of you to come and peek at your future colonies.  

 

Clearing up misunderstandings

Lastly, there may have been a few misunderstandings, mostly thanks to my poor wording on the website regarding success rate of “boosted” colonies.  I call them “advanced” but given the different meanings of this word and how it can really be used to describe the same things (colonies in this place) and mean two different things it was a poor choice of a title.  I did not want to use “boosted” because; as a show owner with the pleasure of talking to a huge variety of people interested in the hobby, my experience to terms like that will typically draw a blank look in response.  “Boosted” means nothing to most everyone not in the hobby already and much of the people I speak with are brand new.  I will be the first to admit that this wasn’t as clear as it could have been, and I am grateful for the feedback and the opportunity to set things straight.  By advanced I simply meant advanced in stage.  Typically, a colony will be a lone queen. Then with eggs, then larvae, then pupae, then workers.   In this case they are a step ahead of others that are offered, which I feel would be good to offer as advanced colonies to anyone who might wish to get to the more exciting stages of colony growth rather than just  a queen with eggs, which is a very common request.  To do this, we had to painstakingly retrieve brood from colonies that were slated to be destroyed as they were on a future construction site, retrieving them one by one.

 

The boosted colonies are in fact (as most of you know already) created with workers from another colony.  The reason for this is threefold.

 

1. First to increase the rate of success for the queen to reach “founding stage” where she has workers of her own.  Having been in the community for a long time now, I am lucky to be able to lean on the experience of my friends 8 years of keeping Pogonomyrmex occidentalis, who relayed to me his findings showing a significant increase in success getting past the founding stage.  Additionally, I was able to find one research study boosting, as well as consulting a number of entomologists and even more experienced ant keepers on the subject.  Generally, the consensus was the same across the board, indicating that this was a good idea.
2. Secondly, to allow folks to enjoy these ants immediately!  With the new regulations in place, this is a historic step for the hobby in the United States – we can finally all get the same ants. 
3. By advancing a colony forward a stage in development from just a queen to a queen with workers, you now have the opportunities to see activities you would not previously, and the queen settles down more readily as well (and based on at least one research study, the potential to lay more eggs of her own early on…).

Honestly, it works the way the research we’ve done suggested it would.  Not a single queen we have boosted to date has died, and on average, boosted colonies see more success compared to unboosted colonies.

 

Regarding Care:

I have decided to expand the PDF guide a bit to something more than a care guide.  You will all see when it is done and hopefully appreciate the effort that is going into it.

 

Order changes and requests:

If you wish to change your order from an Advanced Colony to a Queen, just contact us by replying to this email.  I am more than happy to accommodate any order changes prior to shipping, as has been my policy for several years now.

 

Alternatively, if you wish to delay shipping, which only means I care for the ants longer and ship you a colony once they have workers of their own, please let me know and I will adjust the order accordingly.  This would mean I would be putting your order on hold for 3 to 4 more weeks before selecting the colony to send to you.

 

Any other requests or accommodations are welcome (within reason), just drop me a line and I’m happy to see what I can do.

 

Regarding return policy

For the last 2 years I have had on my website a policy that purchased ants have a 30-day replacement policy.  I’ve only ever needed to this once in that time.  One of my goals is to provide only the best colonies for purchase by constant feeding, maintenance, and observation of all colonies in our care.  These ants are no different.  In this situation with Pogonomyrmex occidentalis I am literally giving the best of the best colonies, as the majority of the colonies in my care are under observation for research regarding optimal care.  I am using powerful camera equipment to see inside each colony daily to determine health of brood as well as examine behavior.  The queens and colonies that are lacking in any way are set aside for research experiments on recovering struggling colonies and queens.  Just so it’s clear, we do not sell them.  If you have a problem with a queen or colony after you receive them, please don’t hesitate to contact us immediately.  The care guide will cover some frequently asked questions but feedback on your experience is integral to improving how we do things.  The sooner you let us know you are having a problem (or having a blast also, we love to hear that as well) the sooner we can help resolve whatever problem you may have.  Ultimately, my goal is to help you explore and enjoy this hobby that we all care so much about.

 

Would love to hear back from each and every one of you.  Thank you so much for taking the time to read this.

 

Sincerely,

 

Mack

 

Mack Pridgen

Owner, Tar Heel Ants

[Mercutia]

I saw that he had changed the description on his webpage however I think the email was a very good touch to make sure that there were no misconceptions from the people who have already purchased.

[Kaelwizard]

The email was not supposed to be shared you know! It was confidential apparently.

[FSTP]

This is great, I'm happy that the description was changed and that the email was sent out to customers. Exactly what I would want to see from an established respected vender such as THA. I still don't like the idea of selling a queen with only boosted workers. However, at least now all the pertinent information needed to make an informed buying decision is there, and that's all that matters in the end.