37 replies to this topic

[Canadian anter]

Canadian anter is right about this. We don't want to hear you people whine about being scammed while doing ILLEGAL dealings.

*cough*Alabama anter*cough*

none of it was done on formiculture.

But the transaction was initiated here AND you guys were complaining about it on Formiculture

[gcsnelling]

Also food for thought I think shipping through States is a little ridiculous because if an antkeeper from Rhode Island wanted to ship ants out of his state compared to an antkeeper in Alaska or California would be totally unfair. I ship and receive ants after researching on the area. I usually know what species there r and how much harm it can do to the "original" environment. In my case, almost any "new" species that gets out will die immediately due to Solenopsis invicta, Linpethuma, Brachymyrmex, and other invasives. So this is my case and thanks for your time! Cheers

Really? You know what harm an escaped ant colony can do, really?

[chickenman297]

 

Anyway, now I actually realize why USDA is so strict about this

And yet in half the country RIFA is so dominant that it almost wiped out any other ant species (and just wait until the Argentine ants get a foothold in the US which will inevitably happen at some point). So in the end even these regulation did little to preserve the environment - if invasive ants go on global conquest they are an unstoppable force of nature (you could also say they're a creeping natural disaster), regulations or not. In the end we can stop invasive ants as much as we can stop a Tsunami.

 

And yet Australia has seen successful eradication of RIFA

 

In Australia, there have been six separate incursions of fire ants. Five recorded in Queensland; and one in Port Botany NSW.

 

In Queensland, the first two incursions were discovered in 2001, one in the south western suburbs of Brisbane and the other at the Port of Brisbane. The third and fourth incursions were found in Yarwun, Central Queensland in 2006 and 2013. The fifth and most recent incursion to Queensland was found  at  Brisbane  Airport in 2015.

 

The Port Botany incursion was discovered in 2014 with the NSW Department of Primary Industries leading the eradication response. Biosecurity Queensland provided assistance in the initial response and provides ongoing scientific and operational support when required.

 

Both the Port of Brisbane and the 2006 Yarwun incursions have been successfully eradicated and the 2013 Yarwun incursion is due to be declared eradicated in July 2016. Spread from the initial Brisbane infestation has led to infestations around the greater Brisbane area including Ipswich, Logan and Redlands.  Isolated  infestation  has also been found in Scenic Rim, Gold Coast and Lockyer Valley.

 

(DAF, 2016, https://www.daf.qld....sked-questions)

[Serafine]

Actually we can effectively stop tsunamis from causing damages to most areas with the right preparations. Japan is perhaps the most prominent example of this because in many areas they have built up large sea walls which do effectively stop tsunamis of the sizes they are designed to handle; but even in NJ during hurricane Sandy there was one really memorable instance where a town was saved by a wall so small that 120 years after it was built it had been completely buried and forgotten yet still did its job.

Obviously they didn't work in Fukushima.
 

You keep making false analogies and false comparisons to justify your twisted logic that you use to rationalize your stupidity. It's quite clear to anyone with an ounce of sense that you are woefully ignorant on the subjects you're trying to talk about. Please do yourself a favor and pick up a book, read some articles, or at the very least take the 30 seconds needed to Google things before talking about them authoritatively.

I would never release an ant species (or any animal) into a habitat where they do not belong. All I'm saying is that invasive species will find ways to invade new places no matter how tight our regulations are. Even New Zealand (which has probably the most rigid plant/animal import law and enforcement in the world) managed to catch wasps and is incapable of purging them entirely.

Edited by Serafine, November 28 2016 - 4:52 PM.

[Reacker]

Are you intentionally missing my point or are you really this dense? I'm going to charitably assume that you're simply missing the point which is that although it is obvious that not all prevention and protection efforts involving both invasive species and natural disasters are perfect 100% of the time, it is in fact quite possible to effectively deal with these issues assuming that the proper amount of planning, resources, and general due care are applied; and it is additionally far easier to prevent these types of problems from occurring than it is to attempt remediation afterwards. You are advocating, against all good sense, the ridiculous and untenable position that we shouldn't attempt to conduct our activities with caution and a mind towards consequence prevention because it is impossible to achieve perfect results 100% of the time. 

 

Fukushima is an excellent example of type of results that we would have if all people and groups in charge of dealing with these issues were as haphazard as you seem to be in all of your thinking and casual disregard of even basic caution. While Fukushima had a insufficiently high sea wall and was poorly designed in general, the plant in Onagawa suffered essentially no damage due to a substantially higher sea wall. chikenman's example of RIFA early detection and eradication in Australia is an excellent example of what can be accomplished when people work together to prevent and fix problems as they occur rather than just putting up your hands and throwing caution to the wind as you are advocating. 

 

https://en.wikipedia...ear_Power_Plant

Edited by Reacker, November 28 2016 - 5:19 PM.

[Reacker]

This entire thread is rapidly convincing me that there needs to be some kind of regulations and restrictions on hobbyist ant keepers just as there are for hobbyist apiarists because it is clear that a significant portion of ant keepers are incapable of exercising the most basic cautions even when actual experts in the field have given them good reasons to do so. 

[AnthonyP163]

Are you intentionally missing my point or are you really this dense? I'm going to charitably assume that you're simply missing the point which is that although it is obvious that not all prevention and protection efforts involving both invasive species and natural disasters are perfect 100% of the time, it is in fact quite possible to effectively deal with these issues assuming that the proper amount of planning, resources, and general due care are applied; and it is additionally far easier to prevent these types of problems from occurring than it is to attempt remediation afterwards. You are advocating, against all good sense, the ridiculous and untenable position that we shouldn't attempt to conduct our activities with caution and a mind towards consequence prevention because it is impossible to achieve perfect results 100% of the time.

Fukushima is an excellent example of type of results that we would have if all people and groups in charge of dealing with these issues were as haphazard as you seem to be in all of your thinking and casual disregard of even basic caution. While Fukushima had a insufficiently high sea wall and was poorly designed in general, the plant in Onagawa suffered essentially no damage due to a substantially higher sea wall. chikenman's example of RIFA early detection and eradication in Australia is an excellent example of what can be accomplished when people work together to prevent and fix problems as they occur rather than just putting up your hands and throwing caution to the wind as you are advocating.

https://en.wikipedia...ear_Power_Plant

I think that I should stay out of this argument, but I just wanted to say that RIFA is still in Australia...... It's been spotted multiple times recently.

[chickenman297]

 

Are you intentionally missing my point or are you really this dense? I'm going to charitably assume that you're simply missing the point which is that although it is obvious that not all prevention and protection efforts involving both invasive species and natural disasters are perfect 100% of the time, it is in fact quite possible to effectively deal with these issues assuming that the proper amount of planning, resources, and general due care are applied; and it is additionally far easier to prevent these types of problems from occurring than it is to attempt remediation afterwards. You are advocating, against all good sense, the ridiculous and untenable position that we shouldn't attempt to conduct our activities with caution and a mind towards consequence prevention because it is impossible to achieve perfect results 100% of the time.

Fukushima is an excellent example of type of results that we would have if all people and groups in charge of dealing with these issues were as haphazard as you seem to be in all of your thinking and casual disregard of even basic caution. While Fukushima had a insufficiently high sea wall and was poorly designed in general, the plant in Onagawa suffered essentially no damage due to a substantially higher sea wall. chikenman's example of RIFA early detection and eradication in Australia is an excellent example of what can be accomplished when people work together to prevent and fix problems as they occur rather than just putting up your hands and throwing caution to the wind as you are advocating.

https://en.wikipedia...ear_Power_Plant

I think that I should stay out of this argument, but I just wanted to say that RIFA is still in Australia...... It's been spotted multiple times recently.

 

I agree that RIFA is still in Australia. I myself have recently captured 2 RIFA queens which I have surrendered to DAF. These 2 queens have lead to the discovery of an infested area which has been treated. The fight goes on and it is not impossible to win.

[AnthonyP163]

Are you intentionally missing my point or are you really this dense? I'm going to charitably assume that you're simply missing the point which is that although it is obvious that not all prevention and protection efforts involving both invasive species and natural disasters are perfect 100% of the time, it is in fact quite possible to effectively deal with these issues assuming that the proper amount of planning, resources, and general due care are applied; and it is additionally far easier to prevent these types of problems from occurring than it is to attempt remediation afterwards. You are advocating, against all good sense, the ridiculous and untenable position that we shouldn't attempt to conduct our activities with caution and a mind towards consequence prevention because it is impossible to achieve perfect results 100% of the time.
Fukushima is an excellent example of type of results that we would have if all people and groups in charge of dealing with these issues were as haphazard as you seem to be in all of your thinking and casual disregard of even basic caution. While Fukushima had a insufficiently high sea wall and was poorly designed in general, the plant in Onagawa suffered essentially no damage due to a substantially higher sea wall. chikenman's example of RIFA early detection and eradication in Australia is an excellent example of what can be accomplished when people work together to prevent and fix problems as they occur rather than just putting up your hands and throwing caution to the wind as you are advocating.https://en.wikipedia...ear_Power_Plant

I think that I should stay out of this argument, but I just wanted to say that RIFA is still in Australia...... It's been spotted multiple times recently.

I agree that RIFA is still in Australia. I myself have recently captured 2 RIFA queens which I have surrendered to DAF. These 2 queens have lead to the discovery of an infested area which has been treated. The fight goes on and it is not impossible to win.

Good luck to you guys over there, I hope you can get those ants out, and maybe Argentine ants will help fight Invicta, although I know that they are invasive too. Save your diversity!

[gcsnelling]

This entire thread is rapidly convincing me that there needs to be some kind of regulations and restrictions on hobbyist ant keepers just as there are for hobbyist apiarists because it is clear that a significant portion of ant keepers are incapable of exercising the most basic cautions even when actual experts in the field have given them good reasons to do so. 

 Wow, can I like this more than once?

[Goldsystem]

This entire thread is rapidly convincing me that there needs to be some kind of regulations and restrictions on hobbyist ant keepers just as there are for hobbyist apiarists because it is clear that a significant portion of ant keepers are incapable of exercising the most basic cautions even when actual experts in the field have given them good reasons to do so.

Wow, can I like this more than once?

I agree, I think it's kind of selfish to endanger the ecosystem in your area just so you can get a "exotic" out of state queen.

[Connectimyrmex]

That's really true. If you "need" that one queen, just move. 

[Martialis]

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Edited by Martialis, February 18 2017 - 5:18 PM.

[dspdrew]

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Stop posting dots.

[Martialis]

 

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Stop posting dots.

 

 

If I could delete, I would. Mistook this topic for another.

[dspdrew]

 

 

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Stop posting dots.

 

 

If I could delete, I would. Mistook this topic for another.

 

 

All you had to do is what you did in this post.

[Martialis]

How do you mean?

[Leo]

hey i once found a small aphenogaster colony on my grapes (with queen), they passed away due to my rookie skills

the grapes were from america

Edited by Leo, February 18 2017 - 9:42 PM.