19 replies to this topic

[Full_Frontal_Yeti]

I started giving my ants Sunburst recently instead of slices of apple. They are stashing too much apple in the nest and i want to cut back on that by replacing the apple with a sugarwater option.

They go for the sunburst, but i think i'd make my own based on the price. If this is going to be a staple, it is a fair bit pricier than giving them a slice of my apple every other day.

Anyone got XP in making their own sugarwater for ants they could pass on? Is it just refined sugar + bottled water, or is it better to use a different a form of sugar for this like raw or confectioners?
Any info on use of dye?

Thanks for any advice.

FFY

Edited by Full_Frontal_Yeti, February 5 2024 - 1:32 PM.

[Zeiss]

If you want to make your own, a sugar to water ratio of 1:3 (sugar:water) parts by volume is how I have always done it. It's pretty much just making hummingbird nectar if you've ever filled feeders.

[Artisan_Ants]

I mix 1 parts water and 2 parts sugar for my sugar water. Just use regular sugar and bottled water like you mentioned. Just put 1-3 drops if you want to dye. Don’t put more than 3 though. Dye on any species looks really cool, and I recommend it. It also helps for keeping track of what your ants like to eat, so you don’t have to worry if they’re eating or not.

Edited by Artisan_Ants, February 5 2024 - 1:54 PM.

[Artisan_Ants]

If you want to make your own, a sugar to water ratio of 1:3 (sugar:water) parts by volume is how I have always done it. It's pretty much just making hummingbird nectar if you've ever filled feeders.

True

[ReignofRage]

There are many options for the sugar you use. You could use hummingbird nectar powder, white sugar, brown sugar, etc.

[rptraut]

Hello FFY;

 

You'll find my instructions for sugar/water and some other useful information here    Making Water Fountains Safe for Small Ants - General Ant Keeping - Ants & Myrmecology Forum (formiculture.com)

 

For my very small colonies I use small pieces of sponge that I saturate with an eye dropper, colonies graduate to a small test tube with a cotton stopper and larger colonies just get a larger version.  Whatever size so they use it up within a week.  For small setups I often use a feeder.

RPT

[BleepingBleepers]

I've ONLY been serving my ants homemade, fresh sugar water since I got them. You've read one or both of my journals, seems like they're doing decent, right?

 

The only premade nectar that I've seen vouched for by long time ant keepers and have been time proven (5-10+ years of using mostly or JUST this one product for their ants) that I know of is the red Perky Pet Hummingbird nectar that can be found in stores like Walmart or online. I even ask them about their thoughts on the harm of the additives / preservatives in it and they said they were also aware of it, but said Perky Pet just had the right combination that seems to work really well for their ants, with little or no issue over that long of a time period. Unless, of course, they ever change the ingredients / what they put into Perky Pet.

Some of these ant keepers also said they SUSPECT some of the other store bought premade nectars are one of the main reason for some of their colonies suddenly dying (and yes, they can die because of many reasons, but based on their many years of experience of keeping many colonies and different kinds of ants, that's what they said)

 

However, I'm paranoid on additives, preservatives and I figure I can easily mix my own sugar + water right in my home. Takes a few minutes every other day.

 

Have tried brown sugar, all natural / organic sugar, the really white sugar, and honey. My ants were a lot pickier when they were a smaller colony of 40 or so, but now, they'll take what they can get.

 

I think it'll depend on your ants as well, but for my ants (both ecto and carpenters), they seem to respond best with 1:3 (1 parts sugar to 3 parts water like the above people mentioned). As long as it's that, doesn't really matter what sugar I use though I have seen some preference changes over time. I've tried 1:2 (sugar to water) and 1:1 syrupy mixture and I mentioned in my CA02 journal first page that they liked it until they didn't and the more universal ratio seems to be 1:3 and it's best for them because they can easily slurp it up and it gives them a good amount of hydration.

 

I asked a cook and he said if I wanted to make some homemade sugar mixture that will last and be all natural, make it VERY concentrated with sugar and put it in the fridge. So that's the con of mixing your own sugar water is that they go bad a lot faster, even in the fridge. So my thoughts was, if I ever wanted, I'd make a 1 part sugar (or more, enough so that it doesn't dissolve in the water as well) to 1 part water and save it in the fridge and whenever I want to, I'd stir, take some out, put it in a bowl, add a few more drops of water, microwave for several seconds, stir, let cool for a minute and serve.

 

I was planning to do dyes when I was going honeypots, I was shopping around like crazy.

Came across this:  CLICK HERE

It's a completely organic, plant based dye, and the people that make it are also VERY responsive to any questions I had and they list a lot of their ingredients on that page too. I haven't tested that out yet, but I was planning to get that to mix with my homemade sugar water for the best natural thing for my honeypots (which I'll prob never get at this point). The only issue is that green and blue have a bit of turmeric which repels ants so I was weary on that. But if you want the nice, ruby red for your honeypots, it's the Dark Red.

 

After a lot of searching, I saw a lot of other food color dyes had additives that are not all that great for humans, so I figure ants live off of this water and didn't want to subject them to the 'experiment'. I really don't trust cheap food coloring in the long term, if unsure, probably best to not add dyes at all IMO.

Edited by BleepingBleepers, February 5 2024 - 5:36 PM.

[ANTdrew]

1:4 ratio is plenty sweet.

[rptraut]

Hello ANTdrew;

 

Is it possible that different species and different situations require different ratios of sugar to water?   Maybe, because some species require different amounts of water.   Some of my ants actually seem to prefer dry sugar.  Is there an ideal ratio that provides the required amount of water in balance with the sugar for feeding to larvae?   

 

I think the sugar/water ratio should be a flexible thing depending on the colony being fed.   Maybe one of the ways to slow down a fast-growing colony is to dilute the sugar more.   Perhaps feeding a higher concentration sugar solution to a smaller colony would boost them and be a safe substitute for honey.   Is it possible to control the growth rate of a colony by manipulating the sugar/water ratio?   Sounds like another Science Fair Project.

RPT

[ReignofRage]

I found the less sugar in the ratio, the faster all of the species I have kept go through it. Which, in some colonies it's nice for them to drain a liquid feeder before it thickens and for other colonies it just doesn't last long enough.

[Miles]

1:4 ratio is plenty sweet.

 

Seconding this -- natural sugar sources are far less concentrated than what many ant keepers offer their colonies. There is also anecdotal evidence that colonies that are processing highly concentrated sugars require more fresh water, which stands to reason.

[BleepingBleepers]

 

1:4 ratio is plenty sweet.

 

Seconding this -- natural sugar sources are far less concentrated than what many ant keepers offer their colonies. There is also anecdotal evidence that colonies that are processing highly concentrated sugars require more fresh water, which stands to reason.

 

 

Was thinking about this. This is my thought. Chit chatting for fun before I have to go wash the damn dishes  

 

This is true, HOWEVER:

 

It goes with what ReignofRage also said

 

I found the less sugar in the ratio, the faster all of the species I have kept go through it. Which, in some colonies it's nice for them to drain a liquid feeder before it thickens and for other colonies it just doesn't last long enough.

 

 

1. Water should always be supplied in the setup anyways.

2. With us, there's no real CON to a higher concentrated mix.

3. While we do try to replicate what happens naturally, we also aim to improve on their living conditions. Success for an ant colony means faster growth and to quickly produce future [edit] male drones and Queens. The natural environment / method means more deaths, means significantly longer growth and development, is much less efficient.

4. Homemade sugar water goes bad a lot faster. I think the PRO to having it concentrated is that it lasts longer for the ants and is no longer left undrunk in the container for it to go bad. If they feel like they need water to balance it out, water should be available anyhow for them to balance it out. Basically, it's the more efficient way of giving sugar to the ants.

5. RPT asked above: "Is it possible that different species and different situations require different ratios of sugar to water?" With a concentrated mix with water served separately, you give the ants the option to balance it out. They can go over there and drink more water if they like it more diluted ... or.... just stay with the concentrated mix if they are ants that prefer it that way.

 

 

Thoughts?

 

Anyhow, AFK ... hate house work......

Edited by BleepingBleepers, February 6 2024 - 11:10 AM.

[Full_Frontal_Yeti]

Thanks eveyrone, and Bleeper for the detailed first hand xp info.

 

Probably be a while before i run out the sunburst, but i'll be mixing up my own next time for sure.

I only asked about dye on the off intrest, i keep pogonomyrmex occidentalis, they don't "tank up" for social feeding or keep repleats so not likely to be of much intrest ot dye really.

 

 

On the ratios mentioned, i'd offer the info that with the sunburst, it gets more popular after the first drying and rehdrying, than when it was fresh and at full concentration.

 

For whatever reason they only  take form the feeders a little bit and they clog up before being emptied much. But if i put a couple drops in a dish they get after that in force, and as it dries i add some water, and they get after that even more then before.

[Mushu]

Natural nectar is approximately 20% sugars so hummingbird nectar mixes are recommended to a 1 to 4 sugar/water ratio. Sucrose and sugar are one and the same. One may say homemade mix with just water is healthier as commercial nectar usually has preservatives if you believe in that. It’s just more work as only sugar/water would turn faster without preservatives.

Syntheic red food dye is frowned upon in the hummingbird community. There’s natural food dyes but they are more expensive.

Perky pets does have a red humming bird nectar that uses red natural dye. Get the concentrate as ready to use is basically premixed for you and doesn’t last as long to be stored.

Having said that I would just use clear hummingbird nectar concentrate or powder and mix it yourself. It can last 3-6 months in a fridge premixed. Use one of those condiment squeeze bottles, size to premix depending on your colony size.

Edited by Mushu, February 13 2024 - 5:21 AM.

[Mushu]

Thanks eveyrone, and Bleeper for the detailed first hand xp info.

Probably be a while before i run out the sunburst, but i'll be mixing up my own next time for sure.
I only asked about dye on the off intrest, i keep pogonomyrmex occidentalis, they don't "tank up" for social feeding or keep repleats so not likely to be of much intrest ot dye really.


On the ratios mentioned, i'd offer the info that with the sunburst, it gets more popular after the first drying and rehdrying, than when it was fresh and at full concentration.

For whatever reason they only take form the feeders a little bit and they clog up before being emptied much. But if i put a couple drops in a dish they get after that in force, and as it dries i add some water, and they get after that even more then before.

Harvester ants or ants in general have a natural tendency to plug up water formed near the nest area, that could be a reason for the plugging if they have something available to stuff with. I don’t really see it with my honeypots.

Edited by Mushu, February 6 2024 - 11:40 AM.

[JesseTheAntKid]

Natural nectar is approximately 20% sugars so hummingbird nectar mixes are recommended to a 1 to 4 surgar water ratio. Sucrose and surgar are one and the same same. One may say homemade mix with just water is healthier as commercial nectar usually has preservatives if you believe in that. It’s just more work as only surgar/water would turn faster without preservatives.

Syntheic red food dye is frowned upon in the hummingbird community. There’s natural food dyes but they are more expensive.

Perky pets does have a red humming bird nectar that uses red natural dye. Get the concentrate as ready to use is basically premixed for you and doesn’t last as long to be stored.

Having said that I would just use clear hummingbird nectar cone teeth or powder and mix it yourself. It can last 3-6 months in a fridge premixed. Use one of those condiment squeeze bottles, size to premix depending on your colony size.

just do 1:5 sugar ratio

[Mushu]

Why not 1 to 4

Edited by Mushu, February 7 2024 - 3:39 AM.

[JesseTheAntKid]

because 20x4 is 80, not 100, 5x20 is 100

[Mushu]

because 20x4 is 80, not 100, 5x20 is 100

I think we’re on the same page. 1 part sugar, 4 part water is 5x20%.

[FormiCanada]

I started giving my ants Sunburst recently instead of slices of apple. They are stashing too much apple in the nest and i want to cut back on that by replacing the apple with a sugarwater option.

They go for the sunburst, but i think i'd make my own based on the price. If this is going to be a staple, it is a fair bit pricier than giving them a slice of my apple every other day.

Anyone got XP in making their own sugarwater for ants they could pass on? Is it just refined sugar + bottled water, or is it better to use a different a form of sugar for this like raw or confectioners?
Any info on use of dye?

Thanks for any advice.

FFY

 

 

 

You will have great success in this regard:

Granulated sugar (table sugar) + Water. Ratio is 1:3 or 1:4. Keep it in the fridge to prevent fermentation.

You can add agar agar which is the secret ingredient to keeping it from fermenting.

 

Add a half drop of food coloring of your choice and there's your secret recipe that most sellers use!

 

 

Cheers!