17 replies to this topic

[gemPietra]

Hi! I've found what I hope are two queens.

Found them both in Melbourne General Cemetery after a day of rain, currently the end of summer so around 20°C (68°F). Both have a brown reflective gaster which I tried to get pictures of. I've got more images in my gallery if these aren't helpful. 

 

Queen1-

Queen2-

Edited by gemPietra, March 5 2020 - 11:29 PM.

[Ferox_Formicae]

Both queens are the same species, some sort of Iridomyrmex.

[Manitobant]

Iridomyrmex bicknelli.

[Ferox_Formicae]

Iridomyrmex bicknelli.

I don't believe there is any way to determine species from these images alone. We'd might as well just leave the ID at Iridomyrmex sp. Let me know it I'm wrong though, and if there is a way to distinguish this ant as I. bicknelli.

[TennesseeAnts]

I would go with Iridomyrmex bicknelli, just because that seems to be the most prominent Iriodomyrmex sp, but I agree with Ferox on this one. We will need some close ups of the head, thorax and abdomen for a sure ID.

[Martialis]

I need to make it my signature at this point. You can’t tell species without very clear photos or a very significant lack of species diversity. (Only one or two very disparate species in a genus native to an area)

But I agree with Iridomyrmex.

[Ferox_Formicae]

I need to make it my signature at this point. You can’t tell species without very clear photos or a very significant lack of species diversity. (Only one or two very disparate species in a genus native to an area)

But I agree with Iridomyrmex.

There are a few species in certain areas you can get to species, even from photos with pretty bad quality, so this doesn't fit for all ants.

[Martialis]

 

I need to make it my signature at this point. You can’t tell species without very clear photos or a very significant lack of species diversity. (Only one or two very disparate species in a genus native to an area)

But I agree with Iridomyrmex.

There are a few species in certain areas you can get to species, even from photos with pretty bad quality, so this doesn't fit for all ants.

 

Did you read the latter part of my post?

[Ferox_Formicae]

 

 

I need to make it my signature at this point. You can’t tell species without very clear photos or a very significant lack of species diversity. (Only one or two very disparate species in a genus native to an area)

But I agree with Iridomyrmex.

There are a few species in certain areas you can get to species, even from photos with pretty bad quality, so this doesn't fit for all ants.

 

Did you read the latter part of my post?

 

Yes, I did, but you didn't mention the fact that certain species with high diversity in an area can be identified reliably to species, even with poor quality images. Some examples of this are Camponotus castaneus from North America, Camponotus fulvopilosus from southern Africa, Cephalotes umbraculatus from Central and South America, and many, many more. But yeah, this is not one of those cases. I'd only feel comfortable leaving this ant at Iridomyrmex sp.

[Martialis]

There are obvious exceptions to anything. 

 

I said genus because, as a rule, this is the case. It wasn't meant to be totally comprehensive.

 

Even so, C. castaenus and C. umbraculatus aren't effective counterexamples here. They both are sole members of a species group or clade within their genera in a given area.  

 

As for Camponotus flvopilosus, an entire closely-related species complex exists around it.  Though C. fulvopilosus's range extends farthest north, it definitely is not accurate to say it is "distinct" from other species throughout Southern Africa. I wouldn't be surprised if some of its more Northern territory has several (undescribed) "local" yet closely related species.

Edited by Martialis, March 6 2020 - 12:53 PM.

[ANTdrew]

Narrowing any insect down to genus puts one light years ahead of the general public, and knowing genus is basically all the hobby ant keeper needs to figure out basic care.

[ponerinecat]

Narrowing any insect down to genus puts one light years ahead of the general public, and knowing genus is basically all the hobby ant keeper needs to figure out basic care.

For the most part yes. But it is pretty cool to say "It's definitely this type" rather than "I think it's one of these few types"

[AntsDakota]

Narrowing any insect down to genus puts one light years ahead of the general public, and knowing genus is basically all the hobby ant keeper needs to figure out basic care.

Most people can’t even tell different subfamilies apart.

[ponerinecat]

 

Narrowing any insect down to genus puts one light years ahead of the general public, and knowing genus is basically all the hobby ant keeper needs to figure out basic care.

Most people can’t even tell different subfamilies apart.

 

With a minimal amount of practice, its easy. Hardest ones are Formicinae and Dolichoderinae. 

[AntsDakota]

Exactly. They just can’t see that for some reason.

[gemPietra]

Would it be appropriate to house them together? Are Iridomyrmex polygyne?

[Martialis]

Would it be appropriate to house them together? Are Iridomyrmex polygyne?

It’s probably best to keep them separate.

[AntsDakota]

Would it be appropriate to house them together? Are Iridomyrmex polygyne?

I believe they are pleometrophic, meaning queens will cooperate during the founding stage and kill each other once nanitics arrive. So yes, you should keep them separate.