10 replies to this topic

[Izzy]

Seeing as my carpenter ants are in hibernation for the next 4 months I want to start a journal to track the growth of my Pogonomyrmex occidentalis colonies, which I am also excited about! They're such unique ants! I mean think about it! They are capable of living only on seeds, and store them in little silos. They're very active! What's not to love? Well, I'm sure the sting isn't from what I hear, but I've yet to be stung. I'm sure it'll happen some day but hopefully not anytime soon.

 

I caught 8 Pogonomyrmex queens this year, and after a lot of research I decided to follow the dirt box method laid out by the one and only Utah Ants in his thread here:
https://www.formicul...es-best-method/

A lot of the research seemed to point to Pogonomyrmex, who are very poor climbers, struggling and having very low success rates in traditional test tube setups. Hence, the dirt box method.

 

I got some cheap tupperware containers from the store, filled them with play sand, and put a Pogonomyrmex queen into each one, and gently set the lids on without snapping them on. I put half of the container on a heating mat so as to create a heating gradient for the ants since heat is a must for these gals.

 

The queens quickly set to work digging their founding chambers.

 

I would moisturize the sand with a spray bottle filled with distilled water whenever it started looking dry. First, I did this on the same side that was on the heating mat, but I noticed that when I did this the water would condensate across the lid and the entire setup would be wet. This led to the dandelion seeds I was putting on the dry side (which ended up always being wet) beginning to mold within 24 hours. Eventually, I pulled the most incredible big brain move of my life and started moisturizing the side not on the heating mat and this fixed everything! I now had a wet side and a dry side and the seeds stopped molding so quickly!

I waited a month and a half to two months and started checking the containers frequently, but I couldn't see anything happening on the surface. I started to wonder if perhaps the queens had died, or if maybe the play sand wasn't the best material to use, or just that I had done something wrong. Suddenly I had the idea to lift up the containers and look underneath. To my surprise, underneath I could see a large network of tunnels in every container! The sudden light also caused the queens and workers to begin scurrying about, but I was so thrilled to see that they were alive, even if it appeared like nothing was happening on the surface. A week later I started to see the first workers coming to the surface to forage for seeds.

 

7 of the 8 queens went on to produce workers, with only one dying. I found her body on the surface. I was surprised to have such a high success rate. The dirt box method reigns supreme! However, I'm now stuck with the predicament of how do I get the ants from their dirt box into a proper formicarium? I worry that they will soon outgrow these boxes, and begin creating hills with the sand and crawling all over my house. Not what you want when they have the worst sting of any ant in the United States.

 

I had Utah Ants build me a small founding formicarium for one of my Pogonomyrmex nests. I bored a hole with a boring tool into the side of one of the most active colonies, and hooked it up to the new formicarium via tubing of the proper size.

 

I have provided a heating cable for the formicarium. A few ants have come to explore, but so far after a week the ants seem content to stay in their dirt box despite the removal of the heat. I'm hoping that eventually once the water dries up in their box they will make the move into the formicarium. I don't think moving them manually is an option as the queen and most of the workers and brood are underground. If anyone has any ideas on how to make this happen that would be great, as I eventually want them in their formicarium, and I need to figure out how to get the other 6 out as well.

As always, any tips, suggestions, or advice are appreciated as I try to grow a large and successful Pogonomyrmex colony!

Edited by Izzy, November 27 2023 - 5:52 PM.

[UtahAnts]

Glad to hear the dirt boxes are working for you with those amazing success rates! Once you see workers foraging consistently, you could simply dump the colony into a container than locate and transfer the workers, queen, and as much brood as possible into the outworld. Or let the dirt dry out and wait. You could also let the dirt dry out and place a water test tube partially buried in the dirt to let the ants move into that for an easy transfer. Looking back I should have made the outworld entrance a bit closer to the surface - looks like you solved it with the rocks. 

[100lols]

I’m so jealous of that beautiful nest you got! Stunning work by UtahAnts as usual.

Awesome write up and super useful information. I have had the same experience with founding in dirt boxes. This is a solid way to found the genus.

I’ve found all of my Pogonomyrmex girls to love Andrew’s harvester mix with some added chia, dandelion, and blue grass seeds. I also give them insects once or twice a week and some betta fish flakes, which they go nutty for. Their brood loves the flakes because all the larvae will be pink from the flakes. Can’t wait to follow along!

[Izzy]

Glad to hear the dirt boxes are working for you with those amazing success rates! Once you see workers foraging consistently, you could simply dump the colony into a container than locate and transfer the workers, queen, and as much brood as possible into the outworld. Or let the dirt dry out and wait. You could also let the dirt dry out and place a water test tube partially buried in the dirt to let the ants move into that for an easy transfer. Looking back I should have made the outworld entrance a bit closer to the surface - looks like you solved it with the rocks. 

 

No worries! I probably should pull the tube back a little as well in the connector and it might be easier for them to access.

 

I'll have to try dumping them in a container and picking them out. I wasn't sure if that would injure them, but when digging up founding chambers I essentially did the same thing so I'm sure it'll be fine! I figure I don't need seven colonies so maybe I can take some of the larvae and try brood boosting them. Any idea if they're receptive to that? Otherwise I guess I just try to sell them or something.

 

 

I’m so jealous of that beautiful nest you got! Stunning work by UtahAnts as usual.

Awesome write up and super useful information. I have had the same experience with founding in dirt boxes. This is a solid way to found the genus.

I’ve found all of my Pogonomyrmex girls to love Andrew’s harvester mix with some added chia, dandelion, and blue grass seeds. I also give them insects once or twice a week and some betta fish flakes, which they go nutty for. Their brood loves the flakes because all the larvae will be pink from the flakes. Can’t wait to follow along!

Glad you've had a good experience with the dirt box! I love how simple it is too. I'll have to try some other foods. I've been giving them an occasional mealworm piece and mostly dandelion seeds, but I imagine like most protein sources its good to have variety. Pink larvae sounds fun! At the moment I can't see what is happening below the dirt. I'll have to get them into some formicarium so I can see them!

Edited by Izzy, November 28 2023 - 12:33 PM.

[Full_Frontal_Yeti]

I too dig this ant. Always active, easy to care for(not needing live bugs to hunt), and, at least for me, will acclimate quickly to well lit conditions for easy top down view nest use.

 

 

@100lols:

though you are surely doing fine as is, I would suggest a different fish flake. Pet food ingredients are listed like people food in order of amounts from most to least.
I found most of the stuff easy to get at petsmart and other such places are largely fillers and preservatives. More flour than fish in many of them.

 

I feed mine these

 

ingredient one is mysis shrimp, and they smell like it to be sure. The ants love em and all the larvae turn redish pink from eating it.
https://www.brineshr...-ounce-85-grams

Also highly recommend these if you feel like splurging or have the pet they're intended for.

They go nuts, it's just freeze dried chicken hearts. But they took to better than the fresh one i tried once.

 

 

Mine started in a mini hearth at about 28 and the queen. I moved them into a top down nest once they were approaching 100, and they don't really care about the light going on/off as the day/night timer. I don't keep them specially shaded or anything and they seem to largely ignore lighting conditions.

 

Edited by Full_Frontal_Yeti, November 28 2023 - 12:58 PM.

[100lols]

[mention]Izzy [/mention] Very interested to see how they do if you decide to brood boost. I’ve never tried it with this genus. I’ve read plenty of success stories of people who have brood boosted Pogonomyrmex’s though.

Can’t wait to see them in the formicarium either!

@[mention]Full_Frontal_Yeti [/mention] your ants are beyond spoiled!!! I love looking to you for inspiration. I actually tried feeding some turkey organs to my ants after thanksgiving cooking. Thought of you of course lol.

With the flakes, I grabbed the cheapest option I could tbh. Didn’t put any effort into the quality of the ingredients…which isn’t how I normally operate, but finacial restraints make me think differently these days… Thanks for the awesome info!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Edited by 100lols, November 29 2023 - 11:12 PM.

[UtahAnts]

As long as the queen already has workers before boosting, I've never had any problems doing it with the species. 

 

That said, each colony will grow at a different rate so holding onto all of them long enough to select those that grow quickly may pay off in a few months.

[Izzy]

They finally moved in the formicarium! I came home after a night out and noticed that they had begun the move. I sat and watched for about an hour, hoping to see the queen, but they lost momentum probably because the lights came on and it startled them. When I woke up they had completed the move. There were a lot more of them then I was expecting, now that I can see them all. I'd say there is around 40ish workers. I only ever would see about 8-10 foraging at a time in the dirt box so I'm surprised to see so many!

 

Here's a few pictures. I loved having the window on the top of this formicarium as it made lighting and photography much easier.

 

Here's a few workers surrounded by dandelion and chia seeds. I think they're chewing on a little piece of honeycomb I put in their outworld and that they pulled into their nest.

 

All hail the queen! I haven't seen her since I caught her!

 

Workers tending to some larvae, and a nice little chia seed hanging out on the left looking like a dinosaur egg or something.

 

I now need to figure out what to do with the remaining 6 dirt boxes. One of them dried out and they did indeed move into the test tube I had placed in, but every time I lifted up the lid they went into an absolute frenzy and started draining from the test tube and going nuts trying to climb up the sides. It was honestly terrifying. I've never seen anything like it. I'm not sure how I'd pick up the test tube with so many of them crawling out and on it within a second of opening it. I decided just to water it again to give them some peace of mind.

 

I'm currently working on my first perfect cast formicarium built out of a petri dish mold. We'll see how it goes with the first one. If this works I may end up making some more and moving them into those.

 

EDIT: On second thought, if I left the lid off the dirt box they'd probably get used to the light and air and not go crazy when I open it.

Edited by Izzy, December 8 2023 - 6:01 PM.

[Izzy]

Its been a while since I provided an update on this colony.

 

I moved them into a Fallen Fortress. Its a little big for their needs, but I think they're about ready to grow into it and they don't seem to be storing their trash in the nest so that's good. I laid a heating cable across the top to provide them with a heat source for their brood.

 

 

They have about 50 workers I'd say, and about just as many brood, so the colony size should double here in the next few weeks I imagine.

 

 

They've created a nice pile of seeds, and recently started storing their more developed brood in the seed pile next to the heat.

 

 

I've been feeding them a varied diet of mealworms, superworms, crickets, and dubia roaches. As well as dandelion and chia seeds. This week I put in a liquid feeder with sunburst nectar and they went wild for it! There was a worker at every single port of the feeder in seconds. I suppose they were getting tired of seeds as their only carbohydrate source.

 

The colony has really gotten over any sensitivity to light, and has grown much more aggressive in their responses. They've created a trash pile in the top left corner of the outworld which I empty often.

 

As for the other Pogonomyrmex colonies I had in the dirt bins... they've continued to grow fast as well and have begun piling the dirt into mounds and ramps up to the sides of the containers. I became worried about escapes so I bought some Sterlite bins and put their dirt Tupperware into the Sterlite bins as a fallback. Honestly, this is ridiculous, and they've become a bit of a hassle. Its crossed by mind a few times to just put them in the freezer and be done with it, but I'd much prefer a solution that doesn't involve killing them.

 

 

My first attempt to deal with them was by moving one of the colonies into a Sterlite bin and putting an acrylic box full of moist sand on top of a piece of firebrick, as seen below:

 

 

This worked great, as all I had to do was leave the lid off the Tupperware, they came flying out of the container and clumsily fell down to the bottom, but soon realized they could grip the fire brick and discovered the moist nest on top of it. After 2 days I walked in to discover them moving the brood into the new container. Later that night I came in just as they were moving the queen. The queen appeared to be dead to me. She looked shriveled, and was not moving at all. She seemed completely incapacitated. I may be wrong since it wasn't the best lighting, but she almost seemed to be covered in something? A single worker carried the queen in its mouth. I thought when the move started the queen would simply move herself. The worker carried what I thought was her lifeless body over the edge of the container, fell off with her, picked her up and carried her straight up the firebrick and into the new nest. At this point the worker set her down and the queen sat motionless for about fifteen seconds. The workers then started to gather around her and they looked like they were removing some coating or something from her. She slowly started gaining back movement and within another 15 seconds she was fully functional and walking around. I haven't kept ants long, but it struck me as the weirdest thing I have yet seen. Has anyone experienced something similar?

Another interesting thing I discovered was that if its really quiet and you disturb your Pogonomyrmex colony (lets say by freaking them out by taking the lid off their dirt box), not only can you hear the ground and dirt writhing in their setup as they move about in a frenzy, but you can hear a high pitched chirping sound apparently caused by stridulating. I've noticed this sound one other time when they are agitated, and it always seemed to last less than a minute right after taking off the lid to their container. You have to stick your ear close, but I found articles online talking about this chirping sound which apparently the sexuals do as part of their nuptial flight. This was the first time I've heard anything about ants making any kind of noise.

 

I'm not really sure what my end goal was here with this dirt box to dirt box migration, but it worked! I think I was hoping to get them into some kind of container which I could sell them in or something, but this still doesn't seem like a good option to me. I successfully made my first formicarium yesterday, so I think Plan B will be to create something for each colony they can live in and I feel good about giving to someone who buys them.

Edited by Izzy, March 17 2024 - 10:12 PM.

[UtahAnts]

Glad to hear they're starting to explode in numbers! That stridulation behavior is pretty cool, but it always catches me off guard, you don't expect ants to make noise. 

 

As for the queen behaving strangely I've never seen anything like that, but with larger colonies the behavior of the queen often changes to some degree. I'm sure many people would be interested in buying those other colonies, even if they are in dirt containers. But I really like the open container look. Really neat to see the colony come out in the open like that!

[Izzy]

Glad to hear they're starting to explode in numbers! That stridulation behavior is pretty cool, but it always catches me off guard, you don't expect ants to make noise. 

 

As for the queen behaving strangely I've never seen anything like that, but with larger colonies the behavior of the queen often changes to some degree. I'm sure many people would be interested in buying those other colonies, even if they are in dirt containers. But I really like the open container look. Really neat to see the colony come out in the open like that!

 

Right!? I never thought they'd make noise! I'll have to see if they exhibit this same behavior when I move the rest of them. It's been interesting to have them in the open. It seems they've adjusted quite well. When I rehydrated the container the other day they just moved outside of it and were hanging out on the firebrick until the moisture levels got a little lower. I thought they'd try to escape.

 

Maybe I'll list them and see if anyone wants them. I think my biggest concern with selling them in the Tupperware was that the dirt would probably collapse trying to move it and kill most of the colony, or that if they weren't perfectly careful they could end up with a car full of harvester ants! I think the acrylic cubes are probably good enough though. I suppose its worth a shot!