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I need help identifying this queen

Started By That_one_ant_guy , May 22 2021 11:24 AM

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23 replies to this topic

#1 Offline That_one_ant_guy - Posted May 22 2021 - 11:24 AM

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So I found this queen next to an argentine trail, and boy she was fast, when I finnaly got her into a test tube I tried to identify her but with no luck do you guys have an idea?

-That_one_ant_guy

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#2 Offline ponerinecat - Posted May 22 2021 - 2:25 PM

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Interesting, she's an exceedingly slim Formica alate.


#3 Offline NickAnter - Posted May 22 2021 - 4:31 PM

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Yeah, that is not normal... If she gets workers I will be astonished. She likely has some genetic defect.


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Hi there! I went on a 6 month or so hiatus, in part due, and in part cause of the death of my colonies. 

However, I went back to the Sierras, and restarted my collection, which is now as follows:

Aphaenogaster uinta, Camponotus vicinus, Camponotus modoc, Formica cf. aserva, Formica cf. micropthalma, Formica cf. manni, Formica subpolita, Formica cf. subaenescens, Lasius americanus, Manica invidia, Pogonomyrmex salinus, Pogonomyrmex sp. 1, Solenopsis validiuscula, & Solenopsis sp. 3 (new Sierra variant). 

#4 Offline Antkeeper01 - Posted May 22 2021 - 4:57 PM

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i wonder what the workers would look like


1X Pogonomyrmex occidentalis 40-50 Workers

1X Solenopsis molesta 10 Workers (mono)

Ants I Want: Crematogaster sp, Camponotus Sp., Ponera Pennsylvanica, Mymercocystus sp.

 

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#5 Offline Manitobant - Posted May 22 2021 - 4:58 PM

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Could it be a formica microgyna group species? The microgyna group have tiny, leggy and slim queens. If so, she is parasitic and will need host workers.
My journals:

Polyergus Mexicanus: https://www.formicul...gs/#entry175528
Lasius minutus: https://www.formicul...cs/#entry174811
Lasius latipes: https://www.formicul...gs/#entry206449
General acanthomyops journal: https://www.formicul...yops-with-eggs/

#6 Offline NickAnter - Posted May 22 2021 - 5:02 PM

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To my knowledge, none in CA look like this. I think this is a fusca group Formica, like francoeuri, that has genetic issues.

 

 

I guess it is possible though, if highly unlikely, so maybe boosting her with some workers could be a good idea.


Hi there! I went on a 6 month or so hiatus, in part due, and in part cause of the death of my colonies. 

However, I went back to the Sierras, and restarted my collection, which is now as follows:

Aphaenogaster uinta, Camponotus vicinus, Camponotus modoc, Formica cf. aserva, Formica cf. micropthalma, Formica cf. manni, Formica subpolita, Formica cf. subaenescens, Lasius americanus, Manica invidia, Pogonomyrmex salinus, Pogonomyrmex sp. 1, Solenopsis validiuscula, & Solenopsis sp. 3 (new Sierra variant). 

#7 Offline Manitobant - Posted May 22 2021 - 5:08 PM

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To my knowledge, none in CA look like this. I think this is a fusca group Formica, like francoeuri, that has genetic issues.
 
 
I guess it is possible though, if highly unlikely, so maybe boosting her with some workers could be a good idea.

this is a long shot, but it could possibly be undescribed. The microgyna group is the least understood of the parasitic formica groups.
My journals:

Polyergus Mexicanus: https://www.formicul...gs/#entry175528
Lasius minutus: https://www.formicul...cs/#entry174811
Lasius latipes: https://www.formicul...gs/#entry206449
General acanthomyops journal: https://www.formicul...yops-with-eggs/

#8 Offline ANTdrew - Posted May 22 2021 - 5:30 PM

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That’s the weirdest looking thing I’ve ever seen.
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"The ants are a people not strong, yet they prepare their meat in the summer." Prov. 30:25
Keep ordinary ants in extraordinary ways.

#9 Offline Manitobant - Posted May 22 2021 - 5:35 PM

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Still even if it isn’t microgyna group, I would give her some formica pupae. Parasitic formica can usually open them by themselves, although callows is also recommended.
My journals:

Polyergus Mexicanus: https://www.formicul...gs/#entry175528
Lasius minutus: https://www.formicul...cs/#entry174811
Lasius latipes: https://www.formicul...gs/#entry206449
General acanthomyops journal: https://www.formicul...yops-with-eggs/

#10 Offline That_one_ant_guy - Posted May 23 2021 - 7:44 AM

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Hmmmmm, yeah I might try giving her some formica pupae, her abdomen his pretty small compared to the rest of her body though, should I try giving her some sugar water?

#11 Offline NPLT - Posted May 23 2021 - 8:09 AM

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So, this may be a longshot, but, maybe this is some sort of an intercaste ant.


Um, uh, Ants!

 

link to journal: https://www.formicul...lt-ant-journal/

#12 Offline Manitobant - Posted May 23 2021 - 8:11 AM

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Hmmmmm, yeah I might try giving her some formica pupae, her abdomen his pretty small compared to the rest of her body though, should I try giving her some sugar water?

yes, most parasite queens are malnourished in the nest due to the amount of alates produced.
My journals:

Polyergus Mexicanus: https://www.formicul...gs/#entry175528
Lasius minutus: https://www.formicul...cs/#entry174811
Lasius latipes: https://www.formicul...gs/#entry206449
General acanthomyops journal: https://www.formicul...yops-with-eggs/

#13 Offline That_one_ant_guy - Posted May 23 2021 - 2:08 PM

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I found some formica workers but couldn't track down the nest☹ but, I gave her some sugar water and she seems to be enjoying it

Edited by That_one_ant_guy, May 23 2021 - 2:09 PM.

#14 Offline ANTdrew - Posted May 23 2021 - 4:46 PM

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That girl needs some donuts and fried chicken.
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"The ants are a people not strong, yet they prepare their meat in the summer." Prov. 30:25
Keep ordinary ants in extraordinary ways.

#15 Offline That_one_ant_guy - Posted May 24 2021 - 5:51 AM

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That girl needs some donuts and fried chicken.


Lol

#16 Offline Chickalo - Posted May 24 2021 - 6:02 AM

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Genetic defect, huh?  Interesting, exited to see what her workers might look like (if they don't look similar that would be somewhat disappointing).  Is it possible if another queen has a similar genetic defect and the colonies alates and drones mix, will it result into a new species or a physical trait difference, like how species can have differentiating colours? 


シグナチャーです。예.

 

#17 Offline Ferox_Formicae - Posted May 24 2021 - 6:19 AM

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I'm seeing a lot of Formica fusca-group species that look fairly similar to this. I'm not going to guess a species, as I'm not the best at Formica identification, but a species similar to F. subelongata seems to be a good match. Take this with a grain of salt though, 'cause I'm no Formica expert.


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#18 Offline NPLT - Posted May 24 2021 - 7:50 AM

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Genetic defect, huh?  Interesting, exited to see what her workers might look like (if they don't look similar that would be somewhat disappointing).  Is it possible if another queen has a similar genetic defect and the colonies alates and drones mix, will it result into a new species or a physical trait difference, like how species can have differentiating colours? 

Most likely the latter for a very, very long time, assuming these can survive and found colonies, but it would definetly not be a new species as this colonies alates could probably still mate with other colonies alates of this species and such a pairing would produce viable and fertile alates. It maybe could develop into a new species, but it would not be within any of our lifetimes, unless someone finds a  way to live thousands or millions of years.


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Um, uh, Ants!

 

link to journal: https://www.formicul...lt-ant-journal/

#19 Offline JamesJohnson - Posted May 28 2021 - 5:20 PM

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Do you know if she is capable of flying? That’d surprise me as much as her being able to have workers, if not more.

#20 Offline Kaelwizard - Posted May 29 2021 - 6:48 AM

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Do you know if she is capable of flying? That’d surprise me as much as her being able to have workers, if not more.

Why wouldn't she be able to fly? If anything she can probably fly better than bulkier species.


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