20 replies to this topic

[windedbread]

I live in california

I found them in really dry area with sand and a little bit of grass

She is 12 to 13 mm

Edited by windedbread, June 10 2020 - 4:01 PM.

[TennesseeAnts]

Formica fusca-group queen. Nice find!

Edited by Ant_Dude2908, June 10 2020 - 4:03 PM.

[windedbread]

Ant_Dude2908

Are you sure because my queen doesn’t look as shiny as Formica fusca

[TennesseeAnts]

Ant_Dude2908
Are you sure because my queen doesn’t look as shiny as Formica fusca

Yes, I'm certain she is in the Formica fusca-group. The group contains several dozen species, and they are all different colors, shininess, etc, but they are genetically dissimilar. Color alone is never enough to differentiate species, though. I can link you to a key for North American Formica fusca-group if you'd like.

[windedbread]

 

Ant_Dude2908
Are you sure because my queen doesn’t look as shiny as Formica fusca

Yes, I'm certain she is in the Formica fusca-group. The group contains several dozen species, and they are all different colors, shininess, etc, but they are genetically dissimilar. Color alone is never enough to differentiate species, though. I can link you to a key for North American Formica fusca-group if you'd like.

 

Yes I would appreciate if you could link the key for North America 

[MinigunL5]

I thought they weren't native to NA?
Look: https://antmaps.org/...s=Formica.fusca

[TennesseeAnts]

This might help: https://www.antwiki....England_Formica

As well as this: "There are 7 Formica species groups in North America, fusca, pallidefulva, neogagates, sanguinea, rufa, microgyna, and exsecta​. Learning to distinguish between the different species groups can take some practice, but I can help get you started.

First off is the Formica fusca-group. Ants in the Formica fusca-group can be fairly easily distinguished from other species groups by the presence of at least some appressed, silvery pubescence. Most species are black or brownish, though certain species can be bicolored reddish-brown and black. The Formica fusca-group used to be classified as its own subfamily, Serviformica. This species group contains the following species (Francoeur, 1973):

subpolita

francoeuri

altipetens

montana

canadensis

pulla

occulata

propatula

neoclara

hewitti

neorufibarbis

subcynea

lepida

pachucana

transmontanis

longipilosa

aerata

pacifica

argentea

subsericea

glacialis

podzolica

microphthalma

accreta

sibylla

subelongata

browni

retecta

foreliana

gnava

xerophila

Ants of the Formica pallidefulva-group are sleek, leggy Formica with unique color variations. Four of the five known species (short of F. archboldi) have two distinct color variations, with some mixing involved, a bright yellow color phase in the south and a deep brown, almost black color phase in the north. These ants have a very shiny cuticle, with little to no pubescence present. The species group was previously classified under the subgenus Neoformica. This species group contains the following species (Trager, MacGown, & Trager, 2007):

pallidefulva

dolosa

archboldi

incerta

biophilica

The Formica neogagates-group can be difficult to distinguish from the Formica pallidefulva-group, and the species groups may need to be told apart by looking at individual species. They are smaller than most Formica, and are typically brown and shiny (Fisher & Cover, 2007). This species group contains the following species:

bradleyi

lasiodes

limata

manni

neogagates

obtusopilosa

oregonensis

perpilosa

vinculans

Sanguinea group Formica are slave-raiders. They are easily distinguished by a "median concave impression on the anterior border of the clypeus (Fisher & Cover, 2007)." Previously classified under the subgenus Raptiformica, the Formica sanguinea species group contains the following species:

aserva

creightoni

curiosa

emeryi

gynocrates

pergandei

peberula

rubicunda

subintegra

wheeleri

Ants in the Formica rufa-group are commonly referred to as "wood ants", and includes the famous European Formica rufa. As the taxonomy of this species group is currently a mess (Fisher & Cover, 2007), there is no real distinguishing feature of this species group, apart from their ecological habits of building thatch mounds and being temporary social parasites, features shared with a few other Formica species group. This species group contains the following species (Stockan, Robinson, Trager, Yao & Yeifert, 2016):

reflexa

dakotensis

paralugubris

oreas

obscuriventris

laeviceps

fossaceps

coloradensis

obscuripes

planipilis

subnitens

ravida

integra

ciliata

mucescens

comata

criniventris

prociliata

ferocula

calviceps

propinqua

integroides

The Formica microgyna-group is characterized by their tiny queens, as small as or smaller than the largest workers (Cover & Fisher, 2007). This unique species group contains the following species:

adamsi

densiventris

difficilis

impexa

indianensis

microgyne

morsei

nepticula

nevadensis

postoculata

querquetulata

scitula

spatulata

talbotae

Finally, the Formica exsecta species group. This species group can be easily recognized by the strongly concave posterior border of the head (Cover & Fisher, 2007). This species group only contains three North American species, those species being:

exsectoides

ulkei

opaciventris" -Ferox_Formicae

[TennesseeAnts]

I thought they weren't native to NA?
Look: https://antmaps.org/...s=Formica.fusca

We really need to clear up this fusca group thing... This is a species group, meaning, its not necessarily F. fusca, but a related species similar to it. Formica fusca are native to Europe, yes.

[MinigunL5]

 

I thought they weren't native to NA?
Look: https://antmaps.org/...s=Formica.fusca

We really need to clear up this fusca group thing... This is a species group, meaning, its not necessarily F. fusca, but a related species similar to it. Formica fusca are native to Europe, yes.

 

Wow, who the f**k differentiated so many species that look so similar?

[TennesseeAnts]

I thought they weren't native to NA?
Look: https://antmaps.org/...s=Formica.fusca

We really need to clear up this fusca group thing... This is a species group, meaning, its not necessarily F. fusca, but a related species similar to it. Formica fusca are native to Europe, yes.

Wow, who the f**k differentiated so many species that look so similar?

Some people with some genetic testing gear, and a LOT of patience... Haha

Edited by Ant_Dude2908, June 10 2020 - 9:18 PM.

[MinigunL5]

 

 

 

I thought they weren't native to NA?
Look: https://antmaps.org/...s=Formica.fusca

We really need to clear up this fusca group thing... This is a species group, meaning, its not necessarily F. fusca, but a related species similar to it. Formica fusca are native to Europe, yes.

Wow, who the f**k differentiated so many species that look so similar?

Some people with some genetic testing gear, and a LOT of patience... Haha

 

What about other genera?  

[Kaelwizard]

Looks like F. sub services or argentea. They are listed above in the fusca group.

[AntsDakota]

I thought they weren't native to NA?
Look: https://antmaps.org/...s=Formica.fusca

We really need to clear up this fusca group thing... This is a species group, meaning, its not necessarily F. fusca, but a related species similar to it. Formica fusca are native to Europe, yes.

Wow, who the f**k differentiated so many species that look so similar?

Some people with some genetic testing gear, and a LOT of patience... Haha

What about other genera?

Same deal.

[AntsDakota]

F. sub services.

Looks like spell check got you there........
Anyways, he meant Formica subsericea.

[MinigunL5]

 

F. sub services.

Looks like spell check got you there........
Anyways, he meant Formica subsericea.

 

Ia this Formica Subsericea? https://www.formicul...-camponotus-sp/

https://imgur.com/a/KsJsEbW

[Antkid12]

Could also be F. argentea.

Edited by Antkid12, June 15 2020 - 2:09 PM.

[AntsDakota]

The two are impossible to distinguish through photos alone.

[ANTdrew]

She does look similar to my F. argentea queen, but you’d need a microscope to verify. Care would be the same for either species.

[Kaelwizard]

F. podzolica also looks like F. subsericea and argentea. F. argentea have longer antennae than the other 2 I believe.

[TennesseeAnts]

F. podzolica also looks like F. subsericea and argentea. F. argentea have longer antennae than the other 2 I believe.

The scapes of F. subsericea reach farther past the posterior margin of the head than either F. podzolica or F. argentea.