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What to do with surviving workers after queen dies?

queen death

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#1 Offline Boog - Posted December 26 2020 - 12:56 AM

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I saved four queens from a swimming pool this summer and kept them in test tube setups after letting them dry out on a cloth. They looked perky and alive, as opposed to the many dead ones I find in the pool now that I'm being watchful for queens. I don't know how long these ants were struggling in the pool water or how bad it'd stressed them out long-term but I gave them a go.

 

One was a black Crematogaster, two were similarly identified as Pheidole spp. and one was unknown to me as I didn't want to disturb her too much. The Crematogaster queen was well fed and calm but eventually died without laying any eggs after a couple of months. I was hoping she would overwinter and then lay in the spring. The two Pheidole queens are currently growing strong but soon in need of new test tubes setups or a small formicarium, I'm still deciding.

 

Then the last unknown queen was a bit of a slow start and seemed the longest to recover from the near drowning she endured but had workers and brood going. I found her dead in their test tube yesterday.

 

From top to bottom: Unknown queen (deceased), Crematogaster queen (deceased), first Pheidole queen saved in late July (testing out wonky test tube setup for this one), second Pheidole queen saved in August.

 

gallery_4140_1944_53816.jpg

 

Because of her tiny size and fragile state, I didn't do any macro shots of her colony yet. I looked up Temnothorax pics and I'd say there's a resemblance but can't get a good angle to take clear pics of them. I'm not interested in getting identification of a colony until they've gotten to a good worker count where I could possibly get better macro shots for ID'ing purposes and this colony was getting close. The queen was slightly smaller than the Pheidole queens with a longer gaster proportionally but their workers are about 1.5 mm as opposed to the 3 mm Pheidole workers. I thought the Pheidole were tiny but these ones are smaller and more orange than red. They have about 10 workers with some late larvae along with a small pile of brood and they're currently tending to the queen's body.

 

I had set up a new test tube they were connected to for over two weeks but they never moved over. Their founding test tube was drying up while developing some dark mold on the cotton that I hoped would've got them moving. I kept the new tube dark, warmer and fed in that tube to entice them over. I saw the workers explore the space and hang out in the newer test tube but the colony never moved over. I wonder if the workers were trying to move her and caused some issues or if she was weak in general and barely surviving.

 

Because of their super tiny size, I didn't want to force or dump the colony and they seemed interested in the new test tube setup so I let them be and keeping up with feedings. With the queen gone I now have some super delicate tiny workers with a small pile of brood to deal with. They're dead ants walking and I wonder how long they'll care for the brood.

 

Has anyone kept their surviving workers until the very end of their lives? :( I can't imagine dealing with a huge colony after their queen's passing.


Edited by Boog, December 26 2020 - 1:02 AM.

My Youtube channel: Ants Navajo               Keeping- Camponotus pennsylvanicus, Tapinoma sessile x 2, Pheidole sp x 2
 
"We may be witnesses to a Biblical prophecy come true - 'And there shall be destruction and darkness come upon creation and the beasts shall reign over the earth.'" - Dr. Harold Medford

#2 Offline ANTdrew - Posted December 26 2020 - 3:39 AM

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Perhaps Solenopsis molesta?
I’ve only ever had the opposite happen where a queen loses all her workers. At that point, I usually give up on the queen.
Edit: I actually remembered that my Pheidole davisi queen kicked the bucket after getting five nanitics. I just put the orphans in my freezer.

Edited by ANTdrew, December 26 2020 - 6:59 AM.

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"The ants are a people not strong, yet they prepare their meat in the summer." Prov. 30:25
Keep ordinary ants in extraordinary ways.

#3 Offline Antkeeper01 - Posted December 26 2020 - 6:19 AM

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this has happened with tetras for me, it was my 8 worker colomy


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1X Pogonomyrmex occidentalis 40-50 Workers

1X Solenopsis molesta 10 Workers (mono)

Ants I Want: Crematogaster sp, Camponotus Sp., Ponera Pennsylvanica, Mymercocystus sp.

 

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#4 Offline gs5248 - Posted December 27 2020 - 9:48 PM

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I once had a tetramorium colony who's queen died. I released the workers into my backyard. If they are going to die, then you might as well let them be in their natural habitat.


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#5 Offline Antkeeper01 - Posted December 28 2020 - 5:42 AM

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I once had a tetramorium colony who's queen died. I released the workers into my backyard. If they are going to die, then you might as well let them be in their natural habitat.

if its immigrans you should not have done that


1X Pogonomyrmex occidentalis 40-50 Workers

1X Solenopsis molesta 10 Workers (mono)

Ants I Want: Crematogaster sp, Camponotus Sp., Ponera Pennsylvanica, Mymercocystus sp.

 

My Youtube channel: https://www.youtube....kUjx-dPFMyVqOLw

 

 Join Our Fledgling Discord Server https://discord.com/...089056687423489


#6 Offline gs5248 - Posted December 28 2020 - 11:43 AM

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I once had a tetramorium colony who's queen died. I released the workers into my backyard. If they are going to die, then you might as well let them be in their natural habitat.

if its immigrans you should not have done that

 

Tetramorium Immagrins is a naturalized invader, and have found their niche in a urban and suburban setting. Also, the workers were queenless, and therefore could not have done any real damage. Plus , argentine ants have already taken over my backyard anyways.


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#7 Offline Kaelwizard - Posted December 28 2020 - 3:30 PM

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I once had a tetramorium colony who's queen died. I released the workers into my backyard. If they are going to die, then you might as well let them be in their natural habitat.

if its immigrans you should not have done that

 

Tetramorium Immagrins is a naturalized invader, and have found their niche in a urban and suburban setting. Also, the workers were queenless, and therefore could not have done any real damage. Plus , argentine ants have already taken over my backyard anyways.

 

That isn't entirely accurate in some places, but they won't have anything to provide for so they probably wouldn't do anything. Besides, if they do damage it would probably be to the argentine ants if they are the only ants living there.


Edited by Kaelwizard, December 28 2020 - 3:32 PM.


#8 Offline Boog - Posted January 5 2021 - 10:57 AM

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So I ended up putting the tiny orphan colony mentioned in the original post in the freezer last week and I've yet to pull them out. I've read about inverts thawing out and still being alive after a time in the freezer. I imagine that's an unpleasant experience so kept them in for more than a week in case that would've happened. I'll probably take them out of the freezer later today when I do my colony feedings when I'll be fetching some frozen crickets.

 

I've also got some fresh bad news, one of my Tapinoma sessile queens was found dead last week too just after I did my original post. They were in an THA Atom Nest for almost a year and they just never had steady growth. She started out as a single queen and worker that I collected from my backyard in the summer of 2019. I captured these ants while they were moving with brood so it's possible she wasn't a young queen and maybe this species has a short lifespan. It's also probable that they thrive best with multiple queens or other symbiotic organisms. I saw lots of rove beetles among the colonies I observed in the backyard so I wonder if they have some kind of reciprocal relationship in their habitat niche. I kept up with the usual sugars, proteins and water while testing their temperature preferences with a heating cable. They seemed to prefer the cooler ends of the formicarium each time I added heat and I drove them out of their nest a few times by having the cable too close to them. So I just avoided heated them much overall and still saw colony growth, albeit slow and not very thrilling to observe. When they had built up a few dozen workers in their early test tube setup, they had some foraging lines that looked cool when feeding. Once the tube dried up and I moved them in the THA Atom Nest, they just never grew as well as that first burst of brood and dwindled down to a handful of workers currently when the queen croaked. RIP Queen Catherine 2019-2020

 

My other Tapinoma sessile queen, Sansa, was in a dual queen colony when it started but that didn't last long and her colony numbers had the same initial strong burst of growth followed by a slow decline. She's currently doing okay, they've been taking in more food recently and their numbers are building back up from single digits, now it's about 2 dozen or so. They had over a hundred workers in a THA Genesis Test Tube setup initially but mold growth and a forced move caused the growth disruption. This colony is in an Ant-Shack Small Ant Nest formicarium and its working so far. I need to properly do a journal update on these Tapinoma colonies as I've mainly focused on my Camponotus colony in my journal posts. By the way, once I started using chili pepper infused olive oil as a barrier, I haven't had any escapes that I can see.

 

I consider myself fairly new to antkeeping so dealing with losing my first colonies is new. I just want to learn more on how to take care of our fellow fourmis friends and I'm glad we got resources like FC to share our experiences. I just wish I had more time to interact with all the interesting content creators here; I do try to read the current posts, keep up with ya'lls journals and use the forum for build inspiration. Happy New Year and here's to more antkeeping joy in 2021!


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My Youtube channel: Ants Navajo               Keeping- Camponotus pennsylvanicus, Tapinoma sessile x 2, Pheidole sp x 2
 
"We may be witnesses to a Biblical prophecy come true - 'And there shall be destruction and darkness come upon creation and the beasts shall reign over the earth.'" - Dr. Harold Medford

#9 Offline ANTdrew - Posted January 5 2021 - 5:58 PM

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I’ve read about Tapinoma fading out like this time and again in people’s journals. I don’t think they’re very suited to captivity. Sorry, man.
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"The ants are a people not strong, yet they prepare their meat in the summer." Prov. 30:25
Keep ordinary ants in extraordinary ways.




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