34 replies to this topic

[LC3]

TL;DR, basic rules to keep in mind:

Only genus and species should always be italicized.

Genus always capitalized, species is never, abbreviations like sp. spp. and c.f aren't capitalized either

sp. stands for 'species', singular

spp. stands for 'species', plural

c.f basically means 'compared to'. e.g Camponotus cf. vicinus, we don't know what species it is, but we are comparing it to C.vicinus

Also using an abbreviation, say T.sessile, the abbreviated 'T' (first letter of genus) ideally would be used after the full name, Tapinoma has been mentioned prior. (Basically so you don't have to type Tapinoma a couple of times) 

 

Here are a few more rules/names that you probably won't ever use, but may often encounter in scientific literature regarding ants.

 var. which essentially means variation, and ssp. or subsp. meaning subspecies.

Edited by LC3, February 18 2017 - 1:51 AM.

[Martialis]

Since this is beginning to happen more, why not bump this topic?

[nurbs]

Since this is beginning to happen more, why not bump this topic?

 

If you only knew the kinds of shorthand nicknames Drew and I give to the species we keep when discussing them privately.

 

Mr. Snelling would no doubt have a hernia 

[Ants_Texas]

I feel lazy just by abbreviating the genus name. 

[VoidElecent]

This has been one of my major pet peeves for so many years.

 

If only there was an entire thread dedicated to proper notation. 

 

I don't think there should be a problem referring to ants in shorthand in chat or in conversation. Worst comes to worst, a little clarification is needed...

Edited by VoidElecent, January 4 2018 - 6:40 PM.

[Diesel]

i think you guys need a hobby other than worrying about shorthand. although i generally spell out the entire names this kinda thing IMO is nit picky. if I'm posting a thread or chatting i'd venture to say 90% of the people on here understand when someone references C. pennsylvanicus. they mean camponotus pennsylvanicus (i see this one almost daily). i have the understanding that some people are more educated than others but come on. I'm all for learning as i go. when i was a newbie not long ago i picked up on the short hands very quickly. on top of that someone who may not be as intelligent or not a great speller might spell it incorrectly only to have you guys ride their [censored]  about that. people come here to learn not to be berated by others because something isn't 100% accurate or correct. rules are rules i know. just adopt its not right so i choose not to look. this is also a way of having a newbie look for other forums to post their questions. after time your numbers dwindle and you become irrelevant. most people on here are decent people. do you honestly think that everyone reads the fine print.I'm going( i was going to say gonna but don't want to [censored] anyone off) 100% NO. LONG LIVE C. pennsylvanicus.rant over.

Edited by Diesel, January 5 2018 - 6:24 AM.

[Diesel]

i tried to short hand pennsylvanicus and it corrected it on its own. i can't even rant properly LOL

[Hunter]

who da [censored] cares on naming its a fourm not ants canada

[drtrmiller]

who da [censored] cares on naming its a fourm not ants canada

Properly writing and formatting scientific names ensures that everyone can be sure they're discussing the same thing. Because it is an internationally recognized system, you can be certain that a properly identified organism described by its scientific name is the same organism, regardless of whether the reader's preferred language system is Chinese, English, or any other language.

Various made-up words derived from actual scientific names make it difficult to communicate with other users who do not share that same fictitious naming system. Even I sometimes come across abbreviated names I do not understand, so I can't imagine how difficult it must be to read for the average person.

It is customary to abbreviate the genus of a scientific name after the genus has already been discussed. For example, after discussing Camponotus pennsylvanicus, the writer and others may then use C. pennsylvanicus to refer to the organism, since it is not necessary to continue spelling the genus name in full once it has already been mentioned in the discussion.

Edited by drtrmiller, January 5 2018 - 9:20 AM.

[noebl1]

I'm personally ok if in a discussion if people shorten to C. pennsylvanicus or L. neoniger if it's obvious that's what the discussion is about and I can Google that and get a relevant response.  I (maybe wrongly) had interpreted the issue here is when people type "tetra", "prens" etc.  If I was starting out in the hobby, Googling "tetra" for example shows me fish even with me constantly Googling for ants, and it's not overly helpful.  

Edited by noebl1, January 5 2018 - 8:32 AM.

[CNewton]

Years ago, I was very active in aquatic forums. Similar to this and many other forums, breeders and experts in their fields frequented the forums and joined in on topics. I had contacts with some very well known and important breeders in the hobby. Everyone was incredibly helpful and friendly. Aquatics, granted, is a huge industry.

 

One of the first things I noticed here, is a profound attention to detail. Spelling, italicization, grammar are all so micro-managed that it can become overbearing. I completely understand the reasoning for this. What I have a harder time understanding is the harsh tone some people get when one of these errors are made. Never, in all my years in aquatic forums, had anyone given any poster a hard time for not spelling Fundulopanchax sjoestedi properly, or, heaven forbid, used the common "fish store" name. Every expert was friendly. Every breeder was encouraging.

 

My only reason for posting this is because, as I've seen Drew mention, this forum has grown significantly in the last year or so. That means new keepers, new business for all the stores that advertise, a new generation to keep this niche hobby alive. And, that's just it. Ant keeping, as a hobby, is niche. It is not mainstream like fish. It is not big money like dogs or reptiles. Businesses need these new people to want to keep ants and want to be active. Sometimes, I feel, this community can scare off potential keepers because they were in a hurry and misspelled Camponotus or didn't italicize or used a word that isn't in the Webster's Dictionary.

 

I know it is important to keep these rules. I know you want to attract a more sophisticated clientele. I know you want your forums clean and tidy and perfect. I also know that berating people for minor infractions can turn people off from a community and hobby. Hell, I speak from experience. After getting jabbed for an error I made, I have stopped myself from commenting altogether. Maybe I'm the only one who felt embarrassed enough to not risk another post getting torn to shreds by the community, I'd hate to think that the harsh retaliation will have silenced other newbies who burn with questions but are now to scared to ask.

 

End rant. Let the stoning commence.

[nurbs]

Years ago, I was very active in aquatic forums. Similar to this and many other forums, breeders and experts in their fields frequented the forums and joined in on topics. I had contacts with some very well known and important breeders in the hobby. Everyone was incredibly helpful and friendly. Aquatics, granted, is a huge industry.

 

One of the first things I noticed here, is a profound attention to detail. Spelling, italicization, grammar are all so micro-managed that it can become overbearing. I completely understand the reasoning for this. What I have a harder time understanding is the harsh tone some people get when one of these errors are made. Never, in all my years in aquatic forums, had anyone given any poster a hard time for not spelling Fundulopanchax sjoestedi properly, or, heaven forbid, used the common "fish store" name. Every expert was friendly. Every breeder was encouraging.

 

My only reason for posting this is because, as I've seen Drew mention, this forum has grown significantly in the last year or so. That means new keepers, new business for all the stores that advertise, a new generation to keep this niche hobby alive. And, that's just it. Ant keeping, as a hobby, is niche. It is not mainstream like fish. It is not big money like dogs or reptiles. Businesses need these new people to want to keep ants and want to be active. Sometimes, I feel, this community can scare off potential keepers because they were in a hurry and misspelled Camponotus or didn't italicize or used a word that isn't in the Webster's Dictionary.

 

I know it is important to keep these rules. I know you want to attract a more sophisticated clientele. I know you want your forums clean and tidy and perfect. I also know that berating people for minor infractions can turn people off from a community and hobby. Hell, I speak from experience. After getting jabbed for an error I made, I have stopped myself from commenting altogether. Maybe I'm the only one who felt embarrassed enough to not risk another post getting torn to shreds by the community, I'd hate to think that the harsh retaliation will have silenced other newbies who burn with questions but are now to scared to ask.

 

End rant. Let the stoning commence.

 

 

Yeah, that.

 

As an older member on here (in both age and membership, ha), there have been posts on here that are truly annoying - like sensationalism, hyperbole, bias, or non-objective rants that read like click-bait news from users who just want attention. Or users asking every other week how they can break the law and transport reproductive ants across state lines. That one never gets old.

 

But policing scientific spelling has never been one of them. It's sometimes humorous, but never bothersome. Can't tell you how many times a 9 or 12 year old kid has PM'ed asking for tech support on how to care for his "pogoneryymerro-merryymix callifuuurrrrrnicus" that he just found in his backyard. We should correct their spelling if it is an honest mistake, but at the same time don't be an elitist about it.

 

Consequently, I butcher names all the time in private messaging. But English is my second language. That's my excuse anyway.

[Batspiderfish]

The occupancy of English ant forums by biologists and myrmecologists is mostly behind us, so the standard of quality is whatever our upstart hobbyists make it out to be. The adherence to proper notation is not enforced; it is only mentioned briefly in nostalgia.

Edited by Batspiderfish, January 5 2018 - 1:18 PM.

[Zeiss]

Years ago, I was very active in aquatic forums. Similar to this and many other forums, breeders and experts in their fields frequented the forums and joined in on topics. I had contacts with some very well known and important breeders in the hobby. Everyone was incredibly helpful and friendly. Aquatics, granted, is a huge industry.

 

One of the first things I noticed here, is a profound attention to detail. Spelling, italicization, grammar are all so micro-managed that it can become overbearing. I completely understand the reasoning for this. What I have a harder time understanding is the harsh tone some people get when one of these errors are made. Never, in all my years in aquatic forums, had anyone given any poster a hard time for not spelling Fundulopanchax sjoestedi properly, or, heaven forbid, used the common "fish store" name. Every expert was friendly. Every breeder was encouraging.

 

My only reason for posting this is because, as I've seen Drew mention, this forum has grown significantly in the last year or so. That means new keepers, new business for all the stores that advertise, a new generation to keep this niche hobby alive. And, that's just it. Ant keeping, as a hobby, is niche. It is not mainstream like fish. It is not big money like dogs or reptiles. Businesses need these new people to want to keep ants and want to be active. Sometimes, I feel, this community can scare off potential keepers because they were in a hurry and misspelled Camponotus or didn't italicize or used a word that isn't in the Webster's Dictionary.

 

I know it is important to keep these rules. I know you want to attract a more sophisticated clientele. I know you want your forums clean and tidy and perfect. I also know that berating people for minor infractions can turn people off from a community and hobby. Hell, I speak from experience. After getting jabbed for an error I made, I have stopped myself from commenting altogether. Maybe I'm the only one who felt embarrassed enough to not risk another post getting torn to shreds by the community, I'd hate to think that the harsh retaliation will have silenced other newbies who burn with questions but are now to scared to ask.

 

End rant. Let the stoning commence.

I have not noticed people being berated for Latin names being incorrect often, but sometimes it is funny how things get spelled.  

 

I mostly notice people (myself included) constantly having to attempt to inform people about the laws about shipping ants, transportation of ants, releasing ants, invasive ants, etc.  There was probably a time when we would have all been very nice and patient with that topic, but it happens so often now, that a lot of us don't have the patience necessary to constantly tell people that what they want to do or are doing is illegal and could possibly be dangerous to the environment, all while keeping a kind tone.  I have been working on my patience with the new people (it's not the best, haha), but it does get a bit tiresome when there are people who refuse to listen to factual information or just basic reasoning.  Some older members may know who I am referring to.

 

Of all the years I have been on this forum, this is what I have observed in recent times as the ant hobby has been gaining a larger following.  I'm glad more people are getting interested in the hobby and possibly entomology as a whole and I welcome everyone who wishes to venture into it.  

[gcsnelling]

The simple solution for me has become if the post is full of wild [censored] abbreviations I do not reply any longer, at one time I spent the time to try and decipher the crap but no more even if I am the only that actually has the correct answer to a question, if the OP can not be bothered to post in a proper manner then I can't be bothered. The same goes for posts in which the images must be accessed with outside links. I will not click on a link posted by someone I do not know. Posting images here is not rocket science. It is so simple even I can do it.