14 replies to this topic

[Barristan]

I had a funny (more frustrating...) discussion in German ant keeping facebook group "Ameisenhaltung" with a moderator there "Nico G." who tells everybody who collected a winged queen that they should release the queen, because:

 

"All winged queens are either unmated or haven't properly mated"

 

I told him that this statement is wrong because queens often shred their wings after collecting, or some even lay eggs while still having their wings. Unfortunately, I couldn't convince him and his two supporters, which had other quite funny beliefs about ants like: "Ant queens mate with 40 males" or "Ant queens after having their nuptial flight can simply take off again and search for a male to mate".

 

How do you see this, do you not collect any winged queens and just the wingless ones or do you still collect queens even if they still have their wings?

 

I personally collect both wingless and winged queens but winged ones only if not near a nest and if it is not a very common and species like Lasius niger or Lasius flavus.

[AntPhycho]

I always collect both as long as they are a ways away from their nest. I currently have many winged Solenopsis xyloni queens with brood piles.

[TennesseeAnts]

I collect any and all queens I see. Even from a nest (only when in need of preserved specimens!).


Edit: 100% of my current Camponotus colonies founded this year were queens that I caught mid flight with a net.

Edited by Ant_Dude2908, June 26 2019 - 1:17 PM.

[CatsnAnts]

Many queens that still have their wings are often times fertile, it’s just you may have captured her before she tore them off. Also if you catch them on a blacklight or in a pool, they often times won’t shed their wings. I (this year) found a wild Camponotus subbarbatus colony that had a winged queen. Yes, it was the queen because she was the only queen ant there, and she was in the nursery chamber with a lot of eggs. I’ve just recently collected a few winged pheidole queens and temnothorax queens, and I can tell you with 100% positivity that at least 1 is fertile. Wings are a terrible indicator of fertility, so never go by it. Hopes this helped!

[ANTdrew]

I caught four Camponotus queens this spring. Two had wings, and of these both currently have five or more workers. I found those literally the moment they landed. One of these has yet to remove her wings.

[SuperFrank]

Ridiculous and false statement said out of ignorance. I have pictures of winged queens from multiple species that founded a colony.

Edited by SuperFrank, June 27 2019 - 4:15 AM.

[VoidElecent]

There is a chance winged queens are not mated. There is no chance dealate queens are unmated. If I know I will have many opportunities to catch queens of a certain species in a season, I'll go for only the dealates—for example, starting around around now, I know Temnothorax will swarm black lights. Instead of wasting my time and trying my luck with winged queens, it's a much better use of time and resources to fill my test tubes with dealate queens, that way in the chance they don't lay, I won't be stuck wondering whether or not they have mated.

 

I would like to add that fertile vs. infertile is different from mated vs. unmated. Queens can still be mated and infertile due to some external factor such as an infection or a parasite, perhaps. If you catch a dealate and she doesn't lay eggs, it could be because she is infertile.

Edited by VoidElecent, June 27 2019 - 5:23 AM.

[Canadian anter]

There is a chance winged queens are not mated. There is no chance dealate queens are unmated. If I know I will have many opportunities to catch queens of a certain species in a season, I'll go for only the dealates—for example, starting around around now, I know Temnothorax will swarm black lights. Instead of wasting my time and trying my luck with winged queens, it's a much better use of time and resources to fill my test tubes with dealate queens, that way in the chance they don't lay, I won't be stuck wondering whether or not they have mated.
 
I would like to add that fertile vs. infertile is different from mated vs. unmated. Queens can still be mated and infertile due to some external factor such as an infection or a parasite, perhaps. If you catch a dealate and she doesn't lay eggs, it could be because she is infertile.

I'd like to point out that sometimes colonies will expel unmated dealates if they have refused to fly

[NickAnter]

Some dealate queens are unmated. For example: wings got stuck, and came off, workers removed wings.

[SuperFrank]

In Florida we have several Pheidole species that are notorious for removing their wings, laying eggs, and tending to them even if they aren't fertile. A queen having or not having wings means absolutely nothing definite. It may increase the possibility one way or the other, but it is not a reliable way to determine a queens viability at all.

[NickAnter]

Like Pheidole navigans/moerens? They seem to be doing this for me.

Edited by NickAnter, June 28 2019 - 5:47 AM.

[WanderAnts]

In Florida we have several Pheidole species that are notorious for removing their wings, laying eggs, and tending to them even if they aren't fertile. A queen having or not having wings means absolutely nothing definite. It may increase the possibility one way or the other, but it is not a reliable way to determine a queens viability at all.

 

I've experienced this with megacephala and floridana queens

[GeorgeK]

I've had winged lasius queen have ~3 batches of workers and still holding on her wings.

[AntsDakota]

AntsCanada himself kept a Lasius colony with a mated winged queen. You tell him that.

[Kaelwizard]

And why does he need to tell him that?